1 *** Dark_Rose_afk has joined #mousetrap
   2 *** Dark_Rose_afk_ has joined #mousetrap
   3 *** Dark_Rose_afk has quit IRC
   4 *** Dark_Rose_afk_ is now known as Dark_Rose_afk
   5 *** Dark_Rose_afk_ has joined #mousetrap
   6 *** Dark_Rose_afk has quit IRC
   7 *** Dark_Rose_afk_ is now known as Dark_Rose_afk
   8 *** Dark_Rose_afk_ has joined #mousetrap
   9 *** Dark_Rose_afk has quit IRC
  10 *** Dark_Rose_afk has joined #mousetrap
  11 *** Dark_Rose_afk_ has quit IRC
  12 *** Dark_Rose_afk has quit IRC
  13 *** API has joined #mousetrap
  14 *** API has quit IRC
  15 *** API has joined #mousetrap
  16 *** Dark_Rose_afk has joined #mousetrap
  17 *** Dark_Rose_afk has quit IRC
  18 *** AndroUser has joined #mousetrap
  19 *** AndroUser is now known as dark_rose
  20 *** dark_rose has quit IRC
  21 *** amber has joined #mousetrap
  22 *** dark_rose has joined #mousetrap
  23 *** Stoney has joined #mousetrap
  24 *** ghislop has joined #mousetrap
  25 *** ghislop is now known as ghislop_afk
  26 *** john_ has joined #mousetrap
  27 *** heidi has joined #mousetrap
  28 *** ghislop_afk is now known as ghislop
  29 *** burdged has joined #MouseTrap
  30 <burdged> hey
  31 <heidi> Hi All
  32 <amber> hello
  33 <dark_rose> Hello
  34 <john_> hello
  35 <ghislop> Hi Darci! :-)
  36 <Stoney> Hi
  37 <ghislop> a few sidenotes....
  38 <burdged> Lori is going to join us a bit late
  39 <ghislop> Darci: we need to get the food order in for SIGCSE... I'll email you about that...
  40 <burdged> Great...I've been thinking about that
  41 <ghislop> Stoney: I have one of my students working on installing Chiliproject... I'll keep you posted...
  42 <ghislop> OK... that's it :-)  we can start the meeting whenever.
  43 <Stoney> oh wow, cool
  44 <burdged> Are we waiting for anyone else?
  45 <ghislop> Logan?
  46 <heidi> Logan can't make it during this time usually, si I think that we have everyone
  47 <burdged> Ok..meeting started
  48 <burdged> #startmeeting
  49 <tota11y> Meeting started Fri Feb 15 18:04:28 2013 CET.  The chair is burdged. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
  50 <tota11y> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
  51 <burdged> who would like to start with updates?
  52 <heidi> How about I start with a reprise of what we learned last time?
  53 <burdged> great
  54 <john_> I guess I'll go first since I have the shortest update: none. Crazy week at school.
  55 <heidi> #topic updates
  56 <heidi> go john
  57 <ghislop> I think that was the update from John?
  58 <ghislop> next?
  59 <amber> ill go
  60 <amber> since last weeks meeting, i found that opencv will not be compatible with python 3
  61 <amber> the version of opencv in the yum repo is 2.3.1
  62 <heidi> Right, that was the update I was talking about.
  63 <Stoney> ack
  64 <amber> version 2.5 might not include python 3 (no rumors yet)
  65 <heidi> This has the potential to be not as much of a problem as might be.
  66 <amber> we might be able to port it over
  67 <heidi> After the end of last week's meeting, Amber and I talked about this issue with Joanie.
  68 <amber> they only said that they are not sure that it can be done, most likely because they did not do significant testing
  69 <burdged> info opencv is not compatible with python 3
  70 <heidi> Joanie then spent some hours checking the compatibility of Mousetrap with Python 3.
  71 <Stoney> burdged need a pound
  72 <heidi> I've just sent you a partial patch that Joanie created to work on this issue.
  73 <burdged> #info opencv is not compatible with python 3
  74 <joanie> the patch gets it compiling to about 89%
  75 <heidi> She also observed that not all applications in Gnome 3 are Python 3.
  76 <heidi> So we should keep this in mind, but keep working on the OpenCV issue and worry about Python compatibility after we get the OpenCV issue fiexed.
  77 <heidi> "fixed"
  78 <dark_rose> I'm starting to document and read about OpenCV and and update the Dev Help page. Added a part about the IRC OpenCV channel
  79 <burdged> #info We should keep working on he OpenCV issue and worry about Python compatibility after we get the OpenCV issue fiexed.
  80 <amber> agreed
  81 <amber> i think we should choose a version
  82 <john_> So why not just leave Mousetrap at Python 2 until the OpenCV community moves over to Python 3?
  83 <amber> *of opencv
  84 <heidi> Well, let's cross that bridge when we get there.
  85 <john_> Do we know which version of OpenCV will be in the repos with Fedora 19?
  86 <heidi> This follows the principles of delaying decisions until they need to be made, providing more flexibility during development.
  87 * heidi looking
  88 <burdged> #info We will make decision about whether to move to python 3 later.
  89 <ghislop> Fedora 19 seems to be scheduled for june 2013...
  90 <ghislop> I suggest we might want to just worry about Fedora 18 for now
  91 <john_> Yes, there should be an alpha out by now though
  92 <heidi> Yes, there is an alpha out now.
  93 <ghislop> Alpha for mid April
  94 <amber> if anything its going to be the 2.4.3 version which is not terribly different from 2.3.1 which is in the repo now
  95 <amber> for fedora 17
  96 <ghislop> (I'm looking at: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/19/Schedule
  97 <john_> If we choose a OpenCV version to build against, I thought it'd make sense to use the upcoming one instead of making it work with a version that will get outdated in a matter of months?
  98 *** lori has joined #mousetrap
  99 <john_> Perfect, then
 100 <amber> the code would be the same john (so far as i can see)
 101 <amber> if we choose to do cv2 we would be ahead of the curve
 102 <ghislop> so perhaps OpenCV 2.3.1 is the right target for now?
 103 <john_> agreed
 104 <amber> depends on how we decide to use 2.3.1
 105 <ghislop> Or are you suggesting OpenCV 2.4.3 Amber?
 106 <heidi> And cv2 is also not python 3 compatible, correct?
 107 <amber> there is a cv2 and then they have cv2.cv which has the possibility to use older modules
 108 <amber> legacy modules*
 109 <amber> correct heidi
 110 <heidi> Got it.
 111 <amber> the docs for both are the same.
 112 <john_> Someone said Python 2 is still being actively used in GNOME 3? Then I think we shouldn't bother worrying until we have to (as per Heidi)
 113 <amber> i think i would like johns opinion on the code before we decide
 114 <heidi> Logan is also looking into this.
 115 <Stoney> what has been decided (can we get that into the "agreed" section)?
 116 <burdged> #info Discussions ongoing as to whether we should target OpenCV 2.3.1 or 2.4.3
 117 <Stoney> thanks darci
 118 <Stoney> Fedora 18?
 119 <burdged> oops...I didn't mean to squash the discussion, I thought we had decided to wait
 120 <heidi> #agreed Fedora 18 is development OS
 121 <Stoney> and python 2?
 122 <burdged> I think the answer is yes for now?
 123 <amber> so I should upgrade to 18 then?
 124 <john_> Definitely
 125 <heidi> Yes, please amber.
 126 <amber> #action Amber upgrade to Fedora 18
 127 <Stoney> #agreed Python 2 is development language
 128 <amber> i can do that today
 129 <burdged> Great!
 130 <heidi> The latest version of OpenCV is 2.4.3 as of November 2012.
 131 <heidi> There are about 2-4 releases of OpenCV per year for the past few years.
 132 <ghislop> Is there any reason to consider 2.3.1 then?
 133 <heidi> Version 2.3.1 is September 2011
 134 <heidi> This is why I went looking.
 135 <amber> its in the yum repo for fedora 17
 136 <ghislop> or should we just jump to 2.4.3?
 137 <amber> im not sure about 18 though
 138 <amber> im fine with that
 139 <ghislop> amber: fine with 2.4.3?
 140 <Stoney> how significant are the changes from 2.3 to 2.4?
 141 <heidi> Appears to be 2.4.3
 142 <heidi> 2.4.3 appears to be in Fedora 18
 143 <amber> yes, but i think we should get a plan for code restructuring first
 144 <ghislop> OK
 145 <amber> there are some large changes that would be made
 146 <heidi> Changes to port to 2.4.3?
 147 <amber> yes
 148 <Stoney> so, we need to fix it first on the current version?
 149 <john_> Simpler, more elegant I hope :)
 150 <amber> we could just move to 2.4.3 from where we are
 151 <amber> yes definitely simpler
 152 <john_> Simpler code is easier to debug -- I think we should move over rather than fix it as-is -- just my opinion anyway
 153 <Stoney> assuming we want to move to the newer version eventually... would the move be easier after getting the current version working, or just jump
 154 <amber> yea i was hitting a wall trying to patch everything, so a move would be preferred
 155 <Stoney> john_ beat me to it :)
 156 <Stoney> so target opencv 2.4.3 now?
 157 <amber> yes
 158 <heidi> So we're agreed to jump to OpenCV 2.4.3?
 159 <ghislop> sounds like we have consensus on 2.4.3
 160 <Stoney> #agreed opencv 2.4.3
 161 <heidi> :-)
 162 <burdged> #agreed We will move to OpenCV 2.4.3
 163 <burdged> :-)
 164 <Stoney> sorry :)
 165 <Stoney> I'll stop
 166 <heidi> NO fuss, this is fine.
 167 <dark_rose> I'll start to really look into 2.4.3 and document that as much as I can.
 168 <burdged> No worries...
 169 <amber> dark_rose, you can change around the stuff i put on the dev_help page, it also is documented by version
 170 <amber> if that helps
 171 <Stoney> Are status reports done?
 172 <ghislop> Such progress!
 173 <amber> :)
 174 <ghislop> or other issues to report?
 175 <heidi> Nice job on the Dev Help page by the way.
 176 <Stoney> I know, I love this
 177 <dark_rose> I'll work on organizing the dev page better starting later :)
 178 <burdged> #action dark_rose will work on organizing the dev page
 179 <amber> next topic?
 180 <burdged> It sounds like we've already addressed next steps
 181 <burdged> Are there others?
 182 <amber> i have one more
 183 <burdged> #topic Next Steps
 184 *** tota11y changes topic to "Next Steps"
 185 <amber> i think it would be beneficial for all who will start to code to come up with a plan to reorganized based on the newest version of opencv
 186 <amber> and to have a separate meeting to talk only coding issues
 187 <heidi> Sure, good idea.
 188 <amber> thoughts?
 189 <Stoney> cool
 190 <dark_rose> I would join in but I'm working more on the history and such rather than coding lol
 191 <burdged> Do we want to discuss a day/time or do a poll?
 192 <heidi> Hmmm, do you want to upgrade to Fedora 18 before upgrating OpenCV amber?
 193 <amber> i will upgrade today to fed 18
 194 <amber> and then i can start the opencv next week
 195 <heidi> OK, that makes sense.
 196 <ghislop> So perhaps a student meeting around the middle of next week?
 197 <amber> i can create a page with some issues we should look into
 198 <ghislop> (to discuss the code issues)
 199 <heidi> Sure, that would work well.
 200 <amber> yes
 201 <heidi> Wednesday at noon might work. I think that Logan has that time free.
 202 <amber> i can do that
 203 <dark_rose> Wednesdays work for Logan and I at noon
 204 <burdged> #info amber suggested that a separate meeting time be set up to discuss coding issues
 205 <john_> I have the whole week off -- if I can do anything please let me know
 206 <amber> how versed are you in the mousetrap code john?
 207 <john_> (after a day or two to recuperate from this week :D)
 208 <john_> Unfortunately I don't know Python
 209 <john_> Apparently it's easy to learn, right?
 210 <amber> yes
 211 <burdged> It may be helpful for John to lurk anyway?
 212 <amber> what have you done before?
 213 <Stoney> I think that's what you're doing on break!!
 214 <john_> C and Java
 215 <amber> your fine
 216 <Stoney> :)
 217 <dark_rose> Python is more plain language than java and C
 218 <amber> should be cake
 219 <dark_rose> So yea you'll be fine :D
 220 <amber> and plus the opencv backend stuff was in C and now is in C++
 221 <dark_rose> Lots of documents online for python as well
 222 <burdged> So, everyone can make it Wednesday at noon?
 223 <amber> yes
 224 <john_> What time?
 225 <dark_rose> Yep, I'll let Logan know to
 226 <Stoney> noon
 227 <john_> I'm not sure -- I work on Wednesday
 228 <john_> I'll try to make it
 229 <amber> i can put together some meeting notes/ describe how moustrap works
 230 <heidi> Ah, that would be great amber.
 231 <amber> #action amber put together notes for wednesdays code meeting
 232 <burdged> Should we include notes from Wednesday's meeting along with our other meeting notes?
 233 <heidi> Yes, makes sense to do so.
 234 <amber> i was thinking it was more like part of the dev_help page eventually
 235 <heidi> Yes, that too!
 236 <heidi> Its easy to post the notes.
 237 <amber> so ill just write them up to the help page first?
 238 <ghislop> sure
 239 <dark_rose> I would say to put the notes as a last section on the page.
 240 <amber> surely
 241 <ghislop> have we done enough damage for today?
 242 <burdged> Any other 'next steps'?
 243 <dark_rose> I think so lol
 244 <amber> i think we all have stuff to do
 245 <amber> :)
 246 <dark_rose> 7 page paper coming up for me....lol
 247 <amber> good luck
 248 <dark_rose> Thanks!
 249 <burdged> It sounds like we can end the meeting?
 250 <amber> #note
 251 <amber> #note meet in mousetrap irc for wednesday code meeting
 252 <heidi> I think that should be a pound sign "info" amber
 253 <burdged> Sounds great, thanks amber
 254 <amber> #info meet in mousetrap irc for wednesday code meeting
 255 <heidi> :-)
 256 <burdged> Thanks everyone!
 257 <Stoney> bye!
 258 <dark_rose> Bye
 259 <john_> bye
 260 <amber> have a nice weekend!
 261 *** Stoney has quit IRC
 262 <burdged> Bye
 263 <john_> see you on Wednesday
 264 <heidi> bye
 265 <burdged> #endmeeting
 266 *** lori has quit IRC
 267 <tota11y> Meeting ended Fri Feb 15 18:45:27 2013 CET.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
 268 <tota11y> Minutes:        mousetrap/2013/mousetrap.2013-02-15-18.04.html
 269 <tota11y> Minutes (text): mousetrap/2013/mousetrap.2013-02-15-18.04.txt
 270 <tota11y> Log:            mousetrap/2013/mousetrap.2013-02-15-18.04.log.html
 271 *** tota11y changes topic to "Mousetrap"
 272 *** dark_rose has quit IRC
 273 <burdged> Greg: would it be easier to talk about food for the workshop or use email?
 274 <heidi> ghislop, wanna talk food?
 275 <ghislop> burdged: email I think
 276 <ghislop> I need to go back and look at the menu again...
 277 <burdged> ok...sounds good
 278 *** john_ has quit IRC
 279 <ghislop> burdged: I'll send you something... or put together your thoughts... whoever gets to if first.
 280 <ghislop> burdged: there's a spreadsheet in dropbox OpenFE Share with a draft of attendees...
 281 <burdged> I saw that, if I recall we have about 10 people?
 282 <ghislop> yes.  should be able to nail down an exact number by Tuesday...
 283 <burdged> Are you expecting more?
 284 <ghislop> ( Sean is undecided, but good chance he won't come... John I want to confirm as not coming...)
 285 <ghislop> I'm not sure if Michelle's event includes dinner
 286 <ghislop> I'll ping all of them and get answers by early next week..
 287 <ghislop> Oh - we're still discussing with Revi whether she's coming at the beginning or end of the day.
 288 <ghislop> I'll work on nailing all that down
 289 <burdged> What about John Dulaney from College of Charleston?
 290 <burdged> He posted something on TOS the other day
 291 <ghislop> burdged: so I guess my suggestion is that we work out menu selections over the next few days and aim to order by Tuesday?
 292 <ghislop> Hmmm I remember seeing the name on TOS... did he inquire about the workshop?
 293 <ghislop> (and are you guys off next week?)
 294 <burdged> Yes, we are off next week
 295 <ghislop> will you be on email some? or is this plan going to be a problem for you?
 296 <burdged> I plan to work almost every day...so, no problem, I will be available
 297 <ghislop> OK.  My inclination is to say: "do take some break!"  but I understand how this happens :-)
 298 <burdged> :-)
 299 <ghislop> so that seems like a workable plan.. OK?
 300 <burdged> Yes
 301 <burdged> Ok...I'm gonna run.
 302 <burdged> I'll be in touch.
 303 <ghislop> take care... have a good weekend ....
 304 <burdged> Thanks, you too!
 305 <burdged> Bye heidi
 306 *** burdged has left #MouseTrap
 307 *** amber has quit IRC
 308 *** API has quit IRC
 309 *** Stoney has joined #mousetrap
 310 *** dark_rose has joined #mousetrap
 311 <dark_rose> heidi, i just reorganized the Dev Help page and added a section for the code meeting notes
 312 <heidi> Ah, good!
 313 <heidi> I'm guessing that you'll likely want to just summarize what you learned and post on the actual page.
 314 <dark_rose> yea, im assuming Amber will take care of that unless she asks me to, i provided the section to start us off
 315 <dark_rose> mostly cuze im still behind everyone when it comes to straight coding lol
 316 <dark_rose> but anyways i'm doing a little more reading then leaving for the day, i'm going to try to work a little more tomorrow depending on how far i get on my essay and homework, have a good weekend and see you monday!
 317 *** dark_rose has quit IRC
 318 *** Stoney has quit IRC
 319 *** ghislop has quit IRC
 320 *** heidi has quit IRC