1 < ebassi> so, agenda for tonight
   2 < bratsche> bitte schoen!
   3 < ebassi> 1. 2.14 release
   4  * bratsche wants to practice German more :)
   5 < ebassi> 2. non-x11 backends readiness
   6 < ebassi> 3. 2.90/3.0 plan
   7 < ebassi> 4. advisory board meeting/conference call
   8 < ebassi> 5. miscellanea
   9 < mclasen> vuntz had the board confcall w. gtk+ participation that he sent mail about
  10 < mclasen> but I don't see vuntz atm
  11 < ebassi> mclasen: poked vuntz
  12 < ebassi> we can probably wait until he pokes back/joins
  13 < mclasen> yep, lets start with something else first
  14 < mclasen> 2.14 release readiness, maybe
  15 < mclasen> tml, bratsche: how does 2.13 look on win32 ?
  16 < tml> mclasen: I don't know of any blocker as such
  17 < mclasen> ok, sounds good
  18 < mclasen> unfortunately, it seems no osx people around this time...
  19 < mclasen> have people played around with federicos latest patch for the file chooser ?
  20 < mclasen> I have seen at least one report of problematic behaviour, I think
  21 < pbor> mclasen: I filed a bug this morning
  22 < pbor> which looks pretty bad (at least on my pc)
  23 < Mikachu> i have a bug in the file chooser here, it doesn't shrink when i click the little triangle thing
  24 < mclasen> Mikachu: that is the regression that federicos patch is supposed to fix
  25 < Mikachu> aha
  26 < Mikachu> nm then :)
  27 < mclasen> pbor: what was the problem ?
  28 < pbor> mclasen: bug #549403
  29 < pbor> the filechooser is popped up in a corner
  30 < Mikachu> what's the # for the patch?
  31 < mclasen> its in svn
  32 < Mikachu> that explains why i didn't find it then
  33 < mclasen> I'll try to get federico to look at 549403
  34 < mclasen> so, maybe time to switch to the 2.90/3.0 plan
  35 < mclasen> I've got a good amount of feedback now, I'll try to fold that into a second draft and send that around tonight
  36 < pbor> mclasen: I'll try to take a look myself if I have a bit of time but that code is pretty awkward
  37 < ebassi> mclasen: sounds good
  38 < ebassi> mclasen: do you plan to put it on gtk.org/mailing list or live.gnome.org?
  39 < mclasen> ebassi: my idea was to send that out to the mailing list around the time of the 2.14 release
  40 < mclasen> and put something more verbose on the website, like a gtk3 section
  41 < mclasen> but I haven't started any work on that
  42 < ebassi> mclasen: okay
  43 < mclasen> hey there is vunt
  44 < mclasen> z
  45 < mclasen> vuntz: you wanted to talk about the board meeting ?
  46 < vuntz> mclasen: well, if you're done with the current topic, sure :-)
  47 < mclasen> I'm done
  48 < vuntz> so, I'll try to keep it short :-)
  49 < vuntz> back at guadec, timj and kris joined the advisory board meeting for 20-30 minutes to present the GTK+ 3 plans
  50 < vuntz> I think it was quite useful for the people who were there
  51 < mclasen> ok
  52 < vuntz> unfortunately, at this meeting we didn't have all the technical people from all advisory board members and we got requests from people asking for a bit more discussion
  53 < mclasen> I see that you talk about a ~30 min presentation by GTK+ people about gtk3
  54 < vuntz> it was also pointed out that it might have been useful to have some ISV/ISD there to get a wider audience
  55 < mclasen> I probably won't be able to do that...
  56 < vuntz> mclasen: well, that's the standard advisory board phone call format for now, and we can certainly adapt it. It's clearly not set in stone
  57 < vuntz> so the board is trying to organize a phone call on september 10th (iirc) with all the right people
  58 < mclasen> vuntz: just saying, I'd be much more comfortable if the gtk3 presentation comes from the people who are actually doing the work
  59 < vuntz> mclasen: oh, sure. Board members are clearly not able to do that
  60 < mclasen> so I'll really hope that of of tim, kris, mitch will be able to attend
  61 < vuntz> and timj generally does a good job about this, so I hope he'll be able to join
  62 < mclasen> vuntz: my current plans for gtk roadmap communication involve assembling an email to send out around the time 2.14 is released
  63 < mclasen> so that will be available by the time the confcall takes place
  64 < vuntz> awesome!
  65 < timj> vuntz: i should, what was the date again?
  66 < mclasen> I also want to look at getting that stuff up on the website
  67 < vuntz> timj: I think it's september 10th (second wednesday of the month). behdad, is this right?
  68 < vuntz> mclasen: great! I'm trying to gather some data to send to the people who will attend the meeting so they can read some stuff before the meeting
  69 < vuntz> will be more productive this way
  70 < behdad> what's that?
  71 < vuntz> I'll also ask them before hand if they have questions, that I'll forward to the gtk+ team
  72 < behdad> oh
  73 < vuntz> behdad: ab meeting?
  74 < behdad> yeah, sep 10 it seems to me
  75 < mclasen> the email I see says sep 11
  76 < vuntz> mclasen: nod. It moved from Thursday to Wednesday
  77 < mclasen> oh, ok
  78 < vuntz> fwiw, I'm talking to the advisory board people to have technical people attend the meeting, so that it's more useful
  79 < vuntz> I'm also trying to reach various companies/projects who might be interested in all that, like eclipse, adobe, real, vmware, etc.
  80 < vuntz> we don't want this to turn out as a "GTK+ people vs others" debate. Instead, we hope it will make it possible to involve new people in the plans
  81 < mclasen> vuntz: it is also important to avoid the impression that 'everyone has a say' in this...
  82 < mclasen> I mean, it is fine to have comments from interested players, but ultimatively, the GTK+ maintainers will have to decide 
  83 < vuntz> mclasen: sure. By "involve" I don't mean people discussing, but people contributing upstream
  84 < vuntz> and helping for GTK+ 3
  85 < mclasen> ok, my calendar looks good right now for the time of the confcall, so I should be able to attend
  86 < vuntz> cool
  87 < mclasen> did I see anybody else commit to being there, timj ?
  88 < mclasen> vuntz: anything else we need to discuss wrt to the meeting ?
  89 < vuntz> well, if you can think of any big ISV that might be interested in joining, just tell me
  90 < vuntz> I got replies from real & vmware. My mail to adobe went in a black hole so far, fwiw
  91 -!- dom [~lachowicz@67.108.223.130.ptr.us.xo.net] has left #gtk-devel []
  92 < vuntz> eclipse people were interested too
  93 < timj> mclasen: i do. and i'll try to get kris & mitch there also (for kris it depends on uni schedule)
  94 < mclasen> timj: ok, thanks
  95 < vuntz> timj: great!
  96 < bratsche> Maybe someone from Medsphere (other than me) wants to join, should I ask them?
  97 < vuntz> bratsche: if it makes sense, yes. Drop me a mail when you know
  98 < bratsche> What is this meeting called?  Advisory board meeting or something?
  99 < vuntz> bratsche: yes, it's a GNOME Foundation Advisory Board meeting, but it's extended to outside people
 100 < bratsche> Okay.  We have a meeting in ~5 mins, I'll just mention it and see if anyone feels the need to join.
 101  * mclasen looks at the calendar
 102 < bratsche> They were asking a lot of questions about gtk3 after reading miguel's and others blog posts, but they seem to have calmed down now anyway.
 103 < mclasen> I'll probably end up doing stable releases a week from now, ~ next wednesday
 104 < timj> mclasen: cool
 105 < mclasen> anything else to discuss ? 
 106  * mclasen gets nagged to pay attention to the kids...
 107  * Mikachu just finished compiling with the filechooser patch, will test in 5 seconds
 108 < Mikachu> but that can most likely wait ):
 109 < Mikachu> :)*
 110 < Mikachu> yeah, same results as paolo
 111 < mclasen> does the expanding work as expected, though ?
 112 < Lethalman> err, i'm not a gtk developer so I'm sorry in advice :) but I was thinking to suggest a common interface for radio/toggle buttons
 113 < Mikachu> yeah, it isn't super big when contracted
 114 < Lethalman> for e.g. gtk3
 115 < ebassi> Lethalman: send it to the gtk-devel-list with an API proposal
 116 < mclasen> Mikachu: ok, thanks
 117 < ebassi> Lethalman: and keep nagging if you don't get comments
 118 < Lethalman> ebassi, ok
 119 < Lethalman> thanks
 120 < Lethalman> I've already filed in a bug a couple of months ago with no replies
 121 < mclasen> later, guys
 122  * mclasen drops out
 123 < ebassi> Lethalman: api proposals should always go to gtk-devel - bugzilla is not very good at discussing stuff
 124 < ebassi> Lethalman: but reference the bug when mailing gtk-devel-list
 125 < Lethalman> ok of course
 126 < ebassi> you'll see people cc-ing it soon enough :-)
 127 < ebassi> okay, so meeting adjourned
 128 < ebassi> will send the minutes and upload the log as soon as possible, as usual
 129 < timj> ebassi: thanks a lot ;)