1 19:04:29 <heidi> #startmeeting
   2 19:04:29 <tota11y> Meeting started Thu Feb  6 19:04:29 2014 CET.  The chair is heidi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
   3 19:04:29 <tota11y> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
   4 19:04:35 <heidi> #topic Updates
   5 19:05:11 <heidi> kevin-brown: Want to update us on what you've been working on?
   6 19:05:23 <heidi> Don't forget to use the #info so that it gets in the notes.
   7 19:05:52 <kevin-brown> #info I've been working on adding Python 3.3 compatibility into MouseTrap
   8 19:06:19 <stoney> sweet
   9 19:06:21 * heidi goes to look at the bug report
  10 19:06:27 <kevin-brown> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691878#c1 for the bug report
  11 19:06:27 <tota11y> 04Bug 691878: normal, Normal, ---, mousetrap-maint, NEW, Convert to Python 3
  12 19:07:11 <stoney> so this XLib issue is new to me
  13 19:07:20 <heidi> Yes
  14 19:07:24 <heidi> New to me too.
  15 19:07:31 <stoney> can you elaborate?
  16 19:07:43 <stoney> or should we wait until discussion
  17 19:07:45 <stoney> ?
  18 19:07:53 <kevin-brown> The current version of Python-xlib is only Python 2 compatible
  19 19:07:56 <heidi> Now is fine.
  20 19:08:14 <kevin-brown> There's a Python 3 version out there which I've linked to, python3-xlib on PyPi
  21 19:08:29 <stoney> saw that...
  22 19:08:41 <stoney> my questions is...
  23 19:08:52 <stoney> how is MouseTrap dependent on it?
  24 19:09:36 <stoney> (I'm not challenging that it isn't... I'm just interested in where/how in code)
  25 19:09:50 <heidi> Yes, right.
  26 19:09:51 <kevin-brown> I believe that it is used/going to be used for mouse movements
  27 19:09:58 <stoney> ah
  28 19:10:26 <heidi> Ummm, OK.
  29 19:10:34 <stoney> now I'm remembering something on this...
  30 19:10:35 <heidi> But I think that Gnome is going to use Wayland
  31 19:10:40 <heidi> In place of X.
  32 19:10:54 <stoney> right... something like that :)
  33 19:10:56 <kevin-brown> That makes sense, I was just updating current dependencies
  34 19:11:15 <stoney> now what is wayland
  35 19:11:17 * stoney looking
  36 19:11:34 <stoney> right
  37 19:11:41 <heidi> #link http://www.muktware.com/2014/02/gnome-3-12-delayed-sync-wayland-release/20584
  38 19:12:07 <stoney> and we have to be careful that we stick to GNOME accessibility infrastructure stuff
  39 19:12:30 <heidi> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2013-March/msg00087.html
  40 19:12:36 <stoney> I'm assuming that that is part of the Wayland effort
  41 19:12:43 <heidi> #link https://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2013-March/msg00087.html
  42 19:13:51 <heidi> Yes.
  43 19:13:57 <stoney> the proposal says the are targeting Summer 2014 (inferred from date of message and timeline given)
  44 19:14:06 <heidi> Roland, what did you learn about wayland when in Montreal?
  45 19:14:44 <stoney> who should/can we ask if this is on track?
  46 19:15:12 <heidi> Sure.
  47 19:15:17 <LoganH> Sorry I'm late
  48 19:15:26 <heidi> Oh, j*nie I'm thinking?
  49 19:15:34 <Roland> I can't recall anything specific on wayland
  50 19:16:01 <Roland> perhaps Logan?
  51 19:16:09 <heidi> LoganH: and paxnovem  we're talking about 	https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691878#c1
  52 19:16:09 <tota11y> 04Bug 691878: normal, Normal, ---, mousetrap-maint, NEW, Convert to Python 3
  53 19:16:23 <heidi> And that MouseTrap is dependent on X11
  54 19:16:24 <stoney> joanie should we be paying attention to GNOME's movement toward Wayland?
  55 19:16:39 <joanie> stoney: yeah
  56 19:16:53 <stoney> joanie: is the target still for summer 2014?
  57 19:17:03 <joanie> we think not lemme find a link
  58 19:17:15 <stoney> joanie: thanks :)
  59 19:17:21 <stoney> joanie: BTW.... HI! :)
  60 19:17:49 <joanie> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2014-February/msg00006.html
  61 19:17:52 <joanie> btw hi back
  62 19:18:01 <stoney> #link https://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2014-February/msg00006.html
  63 19:18:04 <stoney> great thanks!
  64 19:18:17 <joanie> so we still need to worry, but it's "worry"; not WORRY :)
  65 19:18:18 * heidi looks
  66 19:18:26 <joanie> but what would be helpful is a list of needs
  67 19:18:29 * joanie looks for another link
  68 19:18:44 <joanie> https://wiki.gnome.org/Accessibility/Wayland
  69 19:18:53 <stoney> #link https://wiki.gnome.org/Accessibility/Wayland
  70 19:18:57 <joanie> it's a wiki. feel free to edit it to add your needs
  71 19:18:58 <joanie> :)
  72 19:19:05 <stoney> cool :)
  73 19:19:36 <heidi> :-) Thanks.
  74 19:19:51 <joanie> anything else before I go back to my SadHack(tm) afternoon? :)
  75 19:20:12 <joanie> (Lack of proper APIs is why we can't have nice things)
  76 19:20:15 <stoney> not from me
  77 19:20:16 <heidi> :-) wish you were having a HappySack (Hackisac?) afternoon.
  78 19:20:19 <stoney> thanks :)
  79 19:20:20 <heidi> Ah, right!
  80 19:20:33 <heidi> Yes, thanks for answering our question.
  81 19:20:34 * joanie waves (ping me if you need me)
  82 19:20:47 <stoney> great thanks :)
  83 19:21:01 <heidi> So kevin-brown am I correct in assumign that you've gone as far as you can with python3?
  84 19:21:07 <stoney> ok... so we need to figure out how Wayland affects us
  85 19:21:11 <kevin-brown> At this point, yes
  86 19:21:21 <heidi> #info X11 is being replaced by Wayland
  87 19:21:33 <heidi> #action We need to figure out how Wayland affects MouseTrap
  88 19:21:41 <kevin-brown> I just did a quick check for Python bindings for Wayland and didn't find much
  89 19:21:44 <heidi> kevin-brown: Would you like to look at that issue?
  90 19:21:51 <heidi> The Wayland issue? To be clear.
  91 19:22:07 <kevin-brown> Sure
  92 19:22:25 <stoney> I'm wondering where this sits in the stack...
  93 19:22:46 <stoney> If we're on top of GTK... does GTK sit on X11... and will it be moved to Wayland?
  94 19:22:56 <stoney> and if so... do we have much to worry about?
  95 19:23:23 <paxnovem> my understanding that GTk will be migrated to wayland.
  96 19:23:44 <stoney> my point is... I'm wondering if we need python3 bindings for wayland or if we just need GTK
  97 19:23:45 <stoney> ?
  98 19:23:51 <stoney> thanks paxnovem
  99 19:23:53 <heidi> Rigt
 100 19:24:09 <paxnovem> We have to worry about anything that uses X directly instead of a toolkit like gtk
 101 19:24:22 <stoney> right...
 102 19:24:38 <stoney> and we think mouse movement is being done directly to X?
 103 19:25:11 <LoganH> I've converted mouse movement to GTK
 104 19:25:17 <stoney> anyway... we don't have to solve this here... I just wanted to get some of my questions out
 105 19:25:31 <stoney> LoganH: ooooooooo.... me likey
 106 19:25:45 <LoganH> That was in the mouse patch that was applied last friday
 107 19:26:05 <heidi> Ah, OK.
 108 19:26:45 <stoney> I think it would be healthy to take a look at this and make sure we aren't in for any major surprises
 109 19:26:49 <heidi> OK, did a quick search for GNOME architecture.
 110 19:26:56 <stoney> sweet
 111 19:27:01 <heidi> Ah, OK.
 112 19:27:06 <stoney> ?
 113 19:27:20 <heidi> And which bug specifically did you provide the patch for LoganH ?
 114 19:28:16 <LoganH> I don't remember the id off the top of my head. It was the restore mouse movement one
 115 19:28:36 <LoganH> Is there a way to see closed bug numbers?
 116 19:28:55 <heidi> Ah, a closed bug?
 117 19:29:12 <heidi> Yes, you have to do an advanced search and select for clossed bugs.
 118 19:29:55 <LoganH> Yes its closed. Its been commited already to gnome3-wip branch
 119 19:30:17 <heidi> Ah, OK.
 120 19:31:14 <heidi> kevin-brown: Am I correct in assuming that your comment on the patch was done prior to LoganH's bug fix being committed?
 121 19:31:18 <stoney> mabybe BUG 710802
 122 19:31:18 <tota11y> 04Bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710802 major, Normal, ---, lhotchkiss17, UNCONFIRMED, Implement Cursor Movement
 123 19:31:25 <LoganH> Bug 710802
 124 19:32:17 <LoganH> I think there is still some X code in there that relates to clicking. But thats not "real" code
 125 19:32:17 <kevin-brown> heidi: I believe my base branch is the HEAD of `gnome3-wip`, which makes me think something may still be referencing xlib.  But I'll check on that later and rebase if needed
 126 19:32:49 <heidi> Thank you!
 127 19:32:52 <stoney> cool
 128 19:32:54 <LoganH> Since I didn't touch the Clicking functions, code in there still references X11, but we aren't using it
 129 19:33:13 <heidi> Ah, got it.
 130 19:33:30 <stoney> ah... so if we keep porting to GTK we think we'll be safe
 131 19:33:37 <heidi> I believe so.
 132 19:33:42 <stoney> cool cool
 133 19:34:17 <stoney> so that was a long update :)
 134 19:34:20 <heidi> :-) Yes.
 135 19:34:27 <LoganH> I believe so... Based on the Montreal trip, Ryan would worked with us led us down the ways to using GTK for mouse movement, instead of direct X, so that we wouldn't be affected with the wayland transition
 136 19:34:40 <LoganH> Ryan *who* worked with us...
 137 19:34:42 <heidi> ah, OK.
 138 19:34:45 <stoney> aha!
 139 19:34:53 <stoney> even better... that's good :)
 140 19:35:18 <heidi> kevin-brown: Can you update the bug to reflect this discussion?
 141 19:35:34 <kevin-brown> heidi: Yes, later
 142 19:35:59 <heidi> Right, later iss fine :-)
 143 19:36:38 <heidi> #action kevin-brown will update bug report to reflect dependence (or non) on X11 and Wayland
 144 19:36:43 <heidi> OK, who's next?
 145 19:36:52 <heidi> paxnovem: Want to go next?
 146 19:37:18 <paxnovem> sure
 147 19:38:41 <paxnovem> I have been working cleaning some of the readme files to reflect what is needed for building
 148 19:39:49 <heidi> Needed for building what?
 149 19:40:17 <paxnovem> I also spent time looking into the dependencies that we use to solidify a minimum version
 150 19:40:30 <heidi> Ah, OK.
 151 19:40:45 <stoney> (can we git these updates in the notes? #info)
 152 19:40:54 <heidi> #info paxnovem is working on cleaning up the readme files for building the live USB needed for the CCSCNE hackfest
 153 19:41:09 <stoney> tks :)
 154 19:41:13 <heidi> #info paxnovem is also working on figuring out a minimum version.
 155 19:41:24 <heidi> paxnovem: What do you need next?
 156 19:42:08 <stoney> oh right... are we ready for a demo?
 157 19:43:51 <paxnovem> The one issue I am having that I can't get by is that fedora 18 refuses to boot on uefi machines. I can get to work on some, but not all
 158 19:44:11 <paxnovem> I have no issues on fedora 19 or 20
 159 19:44:21 <kevin-brown> Isn't Fedora 18 out of the support cycle anyway?
 160 19:44:26 <heidi> Can get it to work on some machines?
 161 19:44:37 <heidi> Yes, but we were stabilizing the platform for development.
 162 19:44:51 <heidi> Perhaps we should upgrade to Fedora 20? Or 19?
 163 19:45:57 <stoney> can we upgrade well before the hackfest?
 164 19:46:00 <paxnovem> if we were to upgrade, It would make sense to go to 20 so we would have a year of support.
 165 19:46:14 <stoney> paxnovem: i agree
 166 19:46:15 <heidi> paxnovem: Could you please try to upgrade to Fedora 20 and download and install MouseTrap and report back?
 167 19:47:00 <heidi> Looks like 20 is the current stable version.
 168 19:47:25 <paxnovem> Yea, sure I could do that
 169 19:47:58 <heidi> #action paxnovem will upgrade to Fedora 20 and download and install MouseTrap and report back.
 170 19:48:02 <heidi> Thanks!
 171 19:48:25 <heidi> LoganH: Want to report in?
 172 19:48:38 * heidi remembers that I've got a prospective student coming at 2
 173 19:48:51 <LoganH> I got class at 2 as well, so I will make it quick
 174 19:49:20 <LoganH> #info I have started looking at the tracking issue, and am working on getting mousetrap to track the user's head again
 175 19:49:39 <heidi> Cool!
 176 19:49:49 <LoganH> #info I've only spent a few hours on it, and haven't got incredibly far yet
 177 19:49:50 <stoney> can't wait to use my head
 178 19:50:15 <LoganH> I've got it to recalc once, and then just steal the mouse from you :)
 179 19:50:16 <heidi> :-)
 180 19:50:24 <heidi> Ah, interesting.
 181 19:51:04 <LoganH> So its still a work in progress
 182 19:51:06 <heidi> LoganH: So do you need anything from us to continue?
 183 19:51:15 <LoganH> I don't think so, not at this point
 184 19:51:22 <heidi> OK.
 185 19:51:24 <LoganH> Another snow day would be great
 186 19:51:27 <LoganH> Gave me lots of time
 187 19:51:30 <heidi> kevin-brown: Do you have enough to do?
 188 19:51:32 <stoney> lol... right :)
 189 19:51:38 <LoganH> :)
 190 19:51:42 <heidi> Yes! :-) I called 66 accepted students. Knew I'd find most of them at home.
 191 19:51:55 <stoney> wow!
 192 19:51:57 <LoganH> Good thinking heidi :)
 193 19:51:57 <stoney> nice!
 194 19:52:02 <stoney> perfect
 195 19:52:20 <heidi> Yes, worked out well. Except that some didn't answer I think because I wasn't using a WNE number.
 196 19:52:31 <stoney> ah
 197 19:52:37 <heidi> Roland, what are you working on?
 198 19:52:40 <kevin-brown> #info I'm going to look into finishing off the OpenCV conversion (cv -> cv2)
 199 19:52:45 <kevin-brown> Forgot to mention that
 200 19:52:56 <heidi> Ah, good!
 201 19:53:05 <Roland> #info I have received an email from amber yesterday (feb. 5th). She asked about the IRC meetings. I replied Thurdays at 1pm. Her and I will be going over her progress on compiling OpenCV against Python 3 and an information that may help me continue it further. Additionally I've been reviewing bugs, scribbling notes on potential solutions and testing them in my local repo. Furthermore,...
 202 19:53:07 <Roland> ...attempting to test patches and trying to figure why they are not working.
 203 19:53:45 <heidi> Ah, good!
 204 19:54:36 <heidi> Do you have enough to do for the short term?
 205 19:55:07 <heidi> Roland: Do you have enough to do in the short term?
 206 19:55:55 <Roland> Not yet I do not
 207 19:56:02 <heidi> OK, so we should get together.
 208 19:56:03 <stoney> come see me...
 209 19:56:05 <stoney> we'll chat
 210 19:56:07 <kevin-brown> I've got a few questions about the workings of the project that I threw into a markdown file on gist: https://gist.github.com/kevin-brown/395c9c5da3af5d8df3a0
 211 19:56:10 <heidi> :-) Yes, go see Stoney.
 212 19:56:26 <Roland> ok, I have class so im off :)
 213 19:56:36 <stoney> good
 214 19:56:42 <heidi> OK.
 215 19:56:47 <stoney> #link https://gist.github.com/kevin-brown/395c9c5da3af5d8df3a0
 216 19:56:50 <LoganH> I got to head off too.
 217 19:56:55 <heidi> Yes, go.
 218 19:57:01 <stoney> bye all!
 219 19:57:20 <heidi> Me too.
 220 19:57:41 <heidi> Same time next week folks!
 221 19:57:46 <heidi> #endmeeting.