1 17:02:31 <heidi> #startmeeting
   2 17:02:31 <tota11y> Meeting started Fri Jan  3 17:02:31 2014 CET.  The chair is heidi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
   3 17:02:31 <tota11y> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
   4 17:02:48 <LoganH> Oh look.. The bot is working :)
   5 17:02:53 <heidi> :-) Right!
   6 17:02:57 <heidi> #topic Updates
   7 17:03:08 <heidi> So how has everyone been? Good holidays?
   8 17:03:39 <LoganH> Been pretty good.. Holidays have been good, but it has been super cold
   9 17:04:05 <LoganH> I've been at -20 with wind chill for the past 3 days
  10 17:04:07 <heidi> Yes, very cold here as wel.
  11 17:04:23 <heidi> OK, you get the prize, only 10 degrees at my house this morning.
  12 17:04:25 <heidi> ;-)
  13 17:04:46 <heidi> Let's do updates. Please remember to use the hash info.
  14 17:04:51 <heidi> Who would like to go first
  15 17:04:53 <heidi> ?
  16 17:04:59 <LoganH> I'm at -26 right now.. Pridicting -40 at 3pm
  17 17:05:07 <LoganH> I can start
  18 17:05:24 <LoganH> #info I completed cv to cv2 conversion and submitted a patch
  19 17:05:37 <heidi> Ah, yes. Which I haven't reviewed yet :-(
  20 17:06:08 <LoganH> #info I also updated the gtk widget files that are used for the point mapper. The point mapper isn't working yet, but it no longer crashes when enabled
  21 17:06:31 <heidi> Is that in the patch as well (sorry, I'm not up to date)
  22 17:06:32 <LoganH> #info There seems to be an issue somewhere where its getting its size from the parent window
  23 17:06:39 <LoganH> That is in another patch
  24 17:06:55 <heidi> Got it.
  25 17:07:36 <LoganH> #info Finally, I have created a python script on the side to test the lk_points that MouseTrap uses to see if I can figure out how its suppose to work.
  26 17:07:45 <heidi> Ah, cool.
  27 17:08:25 <heidi> LoganH: Are you waiting on me before you can proceed?
  28 17:08:51 <LoganH> #info I have the program following a point, but it won't lock onto the area between the eyes. From communication with the opencv community, it appears that lk_points track image corners, and the area between the eyes is pretty flat (no real distinctive changes), so its hard to use that fucntion for tracking in that location.
  29 17:09:20 <LoganH> #info, so I am trying to determine how flavio had it working originally if the function isn't meant for that kind of area
  30 17:09:46 <LoganH> Heidi, no I'm not waiting on you
  31 17:09:48 <heidi> Hmm, what about using the nose?
  32 17:09:52 <heidi> LoganH: Ah. good.
  33 17:10:14 <LoganH> I tried the nose quickly at one point, and didn't get a much better reading
  34 17:10:43 <LoganH> THe corners that it want's to use are areas like the edge of the head, where there is a big differention between the head and the background
  35 17:10:51 <heidi> Hmmm, I guess the question is if there is a facial feature that is more easily tracked?
  36 17:10:55 <heidi> Lips?
  37 17:10:58 <LoganH> Sometimes it will lock onto my hair line
  38 17:11:09 <LoganH> Sometimes my eyebrow. But I can't seem to keep it consistant
  39 17:11:11 <heidi> Should we make users wear lipstick to emphasize the difference? :-)
  40 17:11:29 <LoganH> Haha :)
  41 17:11:45 <LoganH> Where a yard sale sticker dot on their forehead
  42 17:11:51 * heidi laughs
  43 17:12:27 <LoganH> So that is where I'm at. Still trying to figure out the lk_points, and when I get frustrated with that, working on point mapper issues
  44 17:12:42 <heidi> Ah, OK, good. You've made great progress!
  45 17:12:56 <heidi> Oh, and timesheets went in fine yesterday.
  46 17:13:02 <heidi> (as a side note)
  47 17:13:21 <LoganH> Heidi, saw the pay note this morning, so thank you
  48 17:13:28 <heidi> Might this be something to ask the CV community?
  49 17:13:37 <heidi> How to track something like forehead?
  50 17:13:49 <LoganH> I have an active question out there in the cv forum
  51 17:13:53 <LoganH> As well as stack overflow
  52 17:14:24 <LoganH> I have had a couple correspondences on the opencv forum, and they pointed me to another function to try, which I will give a shot soon.
  53 17:14:29 * LoganH looks for name
  54 17:14:56 <heidi> Ah, good.
  55 17:15:00 <heidi> So you're still in pursuit.
  56 17:15:37 <LoganH> #link http://www.gnebehay.com/tld
  57 17:16:33 <LoganH> And thats all I got :)
  58 17:16:48 * heidi looks
  59 17:17:10 <heidi> Ah, yes, this seems like it is worth investigating. Good job!
  60 17:17:29 <heidi> LoganH: Anything you need to go forward?
  61 17:18:07 <LoganH> Heidi, I don't think so.
  62 17:18:17 <heidi> OK, great.
  63 17:18:24 <heidi> Next? paxnovem how are you coming?
  64 17:19:30 <heidi> Hey stoney !
  65 17:20:00 <stoney> Hi!
  66 17:20:06 <stoney> Sorry... was digging out
  67 17:20:17 <heidi> Ah, no fuss. Don't strain your back!
  68 17:20:35 <paxnovem> Things are moving along, but I had run into a couple road blocks that I think I have an idea how to solve in regards to usb. UEFI is giving some problems for fedora 18 though I think I resolved them.
  69 17:20:40 <LoganH> How much snow down there?
  70 17:20:53 <heidi> I've got around 6 inches.
  71 17:21:07 <heidi> paxnovem: I'm not sure I understand. What is UEFI?
  72 17:21:35 <stoney> Yeah, I'd say 6" too
  73 17:21:50 <heidi> LoganH: how much do you have?
  74 17:23:02 <LoganH> Heidi, Probably about 3" of snow. But also about 2" of ice. We had a 3 day ice storm last weekend
  75 17:23:15 <heidi> Oh, wow! Yup, you do get the prize.
  76 17:23:17 <LoganH> I can ice skate in my driveway
  77 17:23:21 <LoganH> :)
  78 17:23:25 <heidi> :-) I like to ice skate!
  79 17:23:48 <LoganH> Me too!!!
  80 17:24:02 <paxnovem> #info UEFI is a new interface for the BIOS. Many windows computers enable a mechanism which is suppose to provide more security, but is making our lives a bit harder. :)
  81 17:24:32 <stoney> good info :)
  82 17:24:33 <heidi> Ah, got it.
  83 17:25:08 <heidi> paxnovem: So you think you've got a solution?
  84 17:25:19 <john> Actually, UEFI is an extension of EFI, which is a replacement for BIOS (not a new interface). EFI = Extensible Firmware Interface.
  85 17:25:48 <heidi> Ah, thanks for the clarificaiton'
  86 17:26:15 <john> Windows 8 uses UEFI's Secure Boot, which prevents other (unsigned) operating systems from booting.
  87 17:26:34 <john> a) the OS needs to get a key from Microsoft, or b) the user needs to disable secure boot.
  88 17:27:02 <heidi> Ah, thanks.
  89 17:27:06 <stoney> what a pain
  90 17:27:14 * john nods
  91 17:27:17 <heidi> Right! I'm not a fan of Windows!
  92 17:27:29 <heidi> <understatement>
  93 17:27:43 <stoney> is disabling secure boot easy?
  94 17:27:52 <heidi> paxnovem: Do you have a USB that runs MouseTrap on any OS at all?
  95 17:28:00 <paxnovem> #info there is a script that was designed to fix this problem for older versions of fedora. I got it working on my laptop. I haven't tested it on other laptops yet though.
  96 17:28:07 <heidi> Ah, OK.
  97 17:28:24 <stoney> so we have a workaround... good :)
  98 17:29:11 <paxnovem> I have also been looking at virtual box and I can get it working reliably with an external usb webcam, but internal webcams seem a little bit more tricky
  99 17:29:12 <john> stoney you disable Secure Boot in the EFI. It depends on the motherboard.
 100 17:29:35 <stoney> john: that doesn't sound easy for the typical user :(
 101 17:30:06 <heidi> paxnovem: Do you think that it is a driver issue?
 102 17:30:10 <john> stoney but hey! If you have a Mac... no Secure Boot to worry about! *ducks*
 103 17:30:31 <stoney> john: lucky me then :)
 104 17:30:38 <heidi> :-)
 105 17:30:55 <john> heidi doubt it -- likely an issue with capturing the webcam. Internal webcams can use a weird connection scheme that's not easily recognized by a VM
 106 17:31:08 <heidi> Ah, OK.
 107 17:31:27 <heidi> Sounds like the USB approach is more promising, if we can solve the boot issue.
 108 17:31:45 <stoney> paxnovem: what about external-usb web-cams on a system that also has an internal webcam.... can a virtual machine be used then?
 109 17:32:10 <paxnovem> heidi: In my testing, yes.
 110 17:32:25 <heidi> Ah, OK
 111 17:32:30 <paxnovem> As long as they install the oracle add on
 112 17:32:39 <stoney> cool
 113 17:33:13 <stoney> then I wonder if we could get a few more cheap web-cams to have on hand for the hackfest
 114 17:33:36 <stoney> i should try the external usb thing on my laptop...
 115 17:33:43 <stoney> that would be awesome...
 116 17:33:53 <stoney> I could develop on my usual system
 117 17:33:56 <heidi> I think that we could do that. We've got two in the lab.
 118 17:34:08 <heidi> Yes, would be good to test the external USB on a variety of machines.
 119 17:34:15 <stoney> people could share
 120 17:34:28 <stoney> not fun, but doable
 121 17:34:46 <heidi> If the USB approach uses the internal web cam, lots of folks would have that already.
 122 17:35:01 <stoney> right
 123 17:35:48 <heidi> If we wanted to be flexible (and increase the complexity) we could provide both.
 124 17:36:05 <stoney> right... I was just trying to word that  :)
 125 17:36:09 * heidi Notes that I'm talking about the hackfest to be held with CCSCNE in April.
 126 17:36:18 * heidi in Providence.
 127 17:36:21 <john> I know I'm completely out of the loop, but I'll ask anyway: why are you handling webcam connections? That should be left up to the OS
 128 17:37:20 <stoney> john: as heidi just mentioned, we want to host a hackfest at CCSCNE in April
 129 17:37:34 <stoney> we aren't sure what platform students will have
 130 17:37:43 <stoney> s/students/participants/
 131 17:37:57 <heidi> And we're assuming lots of windows machines.
 132 17:37:57 <paxnovem> I think the live-usb will provide a better experience since many peoples laptops don't have the power to run two OS's
 133 17:38:06 <heidi> Right.
 134 17:38:09 <stoney> so we want to make it easy for them to get started as developers
 135 17:38:22 <stoney> paxnovem: i agree
 136 17:38:22 <john> ahh, got it. Carry on. :)
 137 17:38:37 <heidi> john: So we're trying to solve the problem of how to easily get folks started on MouseTrap without having to deal with too many OS issues.
 138 17:38:39 <heidi> :-)
 139 17:38:52 <stoney> hopefully we can get some new developers interested in mousetrap
 140 17:38:58 <heidi> OK, so paxnovem do you need anything from us to keep going?
 141 17:39:09 <paxnovem> heidi: should I also create an instruction set for arm laptops/chromebooks? They are very common in the education space
 142 17:39:38 <heidi> Umm, Not sure yet.  We have some control in that we can specify a minimum configuration for attendees.
 143 17:40:01 <john> Fedora elevated ARM to equal footing with x86 recently
 144 17:40:04 <john> Just saying.
 145 17:40:05 <heidi> First let's get it running on Mac, Windows 7 and 8 and Fedora. Then lets' see.
 146 17:40:27 <stoney> ok... what is ARM?
 147 17:40:34 <paxnovem> Right now, I am ok, but once we come back from break I need to test my final solutions on more flash drives as different brands have nuances
 148 17:40:37 <heidi> Good question stoney!
 149 17:40:44 <paxnovem> ARM is a processor type
 150 17:40:45 <heidi> Ah, sure. We can handle that.
 151 17:40:59 <stoney> paxnovem: thanks
 152 17:41:23 <john> stoney processor architecture (like x86, PowerPC, etc). Normally seen in mobile devices, but recently begun appearing in laptops (the said ChromeBooks) and even servers.
 153 17:41:24 <paxnovem> it is common in phones and now tablets and cheap laptops
 154 17:41:35 <stoney> we don't need to support multiple flash drives do we?
 155 17:41:45 <stoney> we just need to find one that it works with
 156 17:41:50 <stoney> and then get a bunch of those
 157 17:41:54 <stoney> and set them up
 158 17:41:54 <stoney> right?
 159 17:42:17 <stoney> john: cool, thanks for the info
 160 17:42:26 <stoney> paxnovem: you too :)
 161 17:42:33 <heidi> Yes, right.
 162 17:42:42 <heidi> paxnovem: Anything else?
 163 17:42:57 <paxnovem> I think that is it from me :)
 164 17:43:20 <heidi> kevin-brown: Are you there?
 165 17:43:55 <heidi> john, anything to add? How have you been?
 166 17:44:03 * stoney searching for tissues ... brb
 167 17:44:14 <john> Nah, just about to ask if there's anything I can do to help
 168 17:44:57 <heidi> If you'd like to download the most recent version on the gnome3-wip branch and try the patches that Logan has submitted, that would be quite helpful.
 169 17:45:01 * heidi Looks for patch links.
 170 17:45:41 <john> where is Mousetrap hosted on Github?
 171 17:45:51 * stoney back
 172 17:46:02 <LoganH> Bug 691881
 173 17:46:02 <tota11y> 04Bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691881 normal, Normal, ---, mousetrap-maint, UNCONFIRMED, Convert OpenCV to CV 2.3.1 and update corresponding code
 174 17:46:16 <heidi> [Bug 710775] Fix Point Mapper and [Bug 691881] Convert OpenCV to CV 2.3.1 and update corresponding code
 175 17:46:16 <tota11y> 04Bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710775 blocker, Urgent, ---, scott123, UNCONFIRMED, Fix Point Mapper
 176 17:46:25 <LoganH> And That one
 177 17:46:36 <stoney> john: not on github anymore
 178 17:46:42 <LoganH> git.gnome.org/mousetrap
 179 17:46:47 <stoney> john: we work directly off gnome
 180 17:46:53 <stoney> john: what LoganH  said :)
 181 17:47:01 <LoganH> Branch is gnome3-wip
 182 17:47:43 <john> Wow, someone randomly added a Polish translation a few months ago?
 183 17:47:51 <stoney> yup :)
 184 17:47:55 <stoney> awesome eh :)
 185 17:48:04 <heidi> :-)
 186 17:48:14 <heidi> ScottC, anything new from you?
 187 17:50:01 * stoney testing
 188 17:50:19 <stoney> anyone there ?
 189 17:50:56 <LoganH> I'm thinking not
 190 17:51:37 <ScottC> Negative
 191 17:51:48 <stoney> aha :)
 192 17:51:52 <heidi> :-)
 193 17:52:01 <ScottC> Sorry if i'm not 100% attentive, quite busy at the moment :)
 194 17:52:08 <heidi> Not a problem ScottC
 195 17:52:21 <heidi> #topic Meeting time for spring
 196 17:52:26 <heidi> We need to pick a meeting time for spring.
 197 17:52:39 <heidi> Does 11:00 on Fridays generally work for everyone? Or do we need to change this?
 198 17:52:50 * LoganH checking
 199 17:52:53 <stoney> works for me
 200 17:53:25 <paxnovem> *checking
 201 17:53:44 <LoganH> No go. Theory Of Computation
 202 17:53:49 <LoganH> 11-11:50
 203 17:54:04 <stoney> doodle poll?
 204 17:54:54 <john> I don't work on Fridays anymore, so Fridays would be good :)
 205 17:55:02 <paxnovem> I can do 11, but a doodle poll is probably a good idea
 206 17:55:04 <heidi> Or Friday at 10? Just a bit earlier?
 207 17:55:19 <stoney> 10 works for me
 208 17:55:24 <LoganH> 10 is good for me
 209 17:55:55 <ScottC> Same conflict as LoganH
 210 17:56:13 <stoney> ScottC: which means that 10 is good?
 211 17:57:04 <heidi> kevin-brown has a class at 10.
 212 17:57:13 <heidi> OK, we'll do a doodle poll.
 213 17:57:15 <heidi> I'll set it up.
 214 17:57:17 <paxnovem> I have calc 2 at 10
 215 17:57:21 <heidi> right.
 216 17:57:23 <heidi> :-)
 217 17:57:29 <heidi> Anyone have anything else?
 218 17:57:30 <LoganH> Doodle poll it is :)
 219 17:57:33 <stoney> oops
 220 17:57:54 <LoganH> I think I am good :)
 221 17:58:11 <heidi> #action Create doodle poll for spring meeting time.
 222 17:58:12 <stoney> I've got nothing :)
 223 17:58:21 <heidi> OK, then let's call this meeting.
 224 17:58:24 <heidi> #endmeeting