17:02:31 <heidi> #startmeeting
17:02:31 <tota11y> Meeting started Fri Jan  3 17:02:31 2014 CET.  The chair is heidi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:02:31 <tota11y> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
17:02:48 <LoganH> Oh look.. The bot is working :)
17:02:53 <heidi> :-) Right!
17:02:57 <heidi> #topic Updates
17:03:08 <heidi> So how has everyone been? Good holidays?
17:03:39 <LoganH> Been pretty good.. Holidays have been good, but it has been super cold
17:04:05 <LoganH> I've been at -20 with wind chill for the past 3 days
17:04:07 <heidi> Yes, very cold here as wel.
17:04:23 <heidi> OK, you get the prize, only 10 degrees at my house this morning.
17:04:25 <heidi> ;-)
17:04:46 <heidi> Let's do updates. Please remember to use the hash info.
17:04:51 <heidi> Who would like to go first
17:04:53 <heidi> ?
17:04:59 <LoganH> I'm at -26 right now.. Pridicting -40 at 3pm
17:05:07 <LoganH> I can start
17:05:24 <LoganH> #info I completed cv to cv2 conversion and submitted a patch
17:05:37 <heidi> Ah, yes. Which I haven't reviewed yet :-(
17:06:08 <LoganH> #info I also updated the gtk widget files that are used for the point mapper. The point mapper isn't working yet, but it no longer crashes when enabled
17:06:31 <heidi> Is that in the patch as well (sorry, I'm not up to date)
17:06:32 <LoganH> #info There seems to be an issue somewhere where its getting its size from the parent window
17:06:39 <LoganH> That is in another patch
17:06:55 <heidi> Got it.
17:07:36 <LoganH> #info Finally, I have created a python script on the side to test the lk_points that MouseTrap uses to see if I can figure out how its suppose to work.
17:07:45 <heidi> Ah, cool.
17:08:25 <heidi> LoganH: Are you waiting on me before you can proceed?
17:08:51 <LoganH> #info I have the program following a point, but it won't lock onto the area between the eyes. From communication with the opencv community, it appears that lk_points track image corners, and the area between the eyes is pretty flat (no real distinctive changes), so its hard to use that fucntion for tracking in that location.
17:09:20 <LoganH> #info, so I am trying to determine how flavio had it working originally if the function isn't meant for that kind of area
17:09:46 <LoganH> Heidi, no I'm not waiting on you
17:09:48 <heidi> Hmm, what about using the nose?
17:09:52 <heidi> LoganH: Ah. good.
17:10:14 <LoganH> I tried the nose quickly at one point, and didn't get a much better reading
17:10:43 <LoganH> THe corners that it want's to use are areas like the edge of the head, where there is a big differention between the head and the background
17:10:51 <heidi> Hmmm, I guess the question is if there is a facial feature that is more easily tracked?
17:10:55 <heidi> Lips?
17:10:58 <LoganH> Sometimes it will lock onto my hair line
17:11:09 <LoganH> Sometimes my eyebrow. But I can't seem to keep it consistant
17:11:11 <heidi> Should we make users wear lipstick to emphasize the difference? :-)
17:11:29 <LoganH> Haha :)
17:11:45 <LoganH> Where a yard sale sticker dot on their forehead
17:11:51 * heidi laughs
17:12:27 <LoganH> So that is where I'm at. Still trying to figure out the lk_points, and when I get frustrated with that, working on point mapper issues
17:12:42 <heidi> Ah, OK, good. You've made great progress!
17:12:56 <heidi> Oh, and timesheets went in fine yesterday.
17:13:02 <heidi> (as a side note)
17:13:21 <LoganH> Heidi, saw the pay note this morning, so thank you
17:13:28 <heidi> Might this be something to ask the CV community?
17:13:37 <heidi> How to track something like forehead?
17:13:49 <LoganH> I have an active question out there in the cv forum
17:13:53 <LoganH> As well as stack overflow
17:14:24 <LoganH> I have had a couple correspondences on the opencv forum, and they pointed me to another function to try, which I will give a shot soon.
17:14:29 * LoganH looks for name
17:14:56 <heidi> Ah, good.
17:15:00 <heidi> So you're still in pursuit.
17:15:37 <LoganH> #link http://www.gnebehay.com/tld
17:16:33 <LoganH> And thats all I got :)
17:16:48 * heidi looks
17:17:10 <heidi> Ah, yes, this seems like it is worth investigating. Good job!
17:17:29 <heidi> LoganH: Anything you need to go forward?
17:18:07 <LoganH> Heidi, I don't think so.
17:18:17 <heidi> OK, great.
17:18:24 <heidi> Next? paxnovem how are you coming?
17:19:30 <heidi> Hey stoney !
17:20:00 <stoney> Hi!
17:20:06 <stoney> Sorry... was digging out
17:20:17 <heidi> Ah, no fuss. Don't strain your back!
17:20:35 <paxnovem> Things are moving along, but I had run into a couple road blocks that I think I have an idea how to solve in regards to usb. UEFI is giving some problems for fedora 18 though I think I resolved them.
17:20:40 <LoganH> How much snow down there?
17:20:53 <heidi> I've got around 6 inches.
17:21:07 <heidi> paxnovem: I'm not sure I understand. What is UEFI?
17:21:35 <stoney> Yeah, I'd say 6" too
17:21:50 <heidi> LoganH: how much do you have?
17:23:02 <LoganH> Heidi, Probably about 3" of snow. But also about 2" of ice. We had a 3 day ice storm last weekend
17:23:15 <heidi> Oh, wow! Yup, you do get the prize.
17:23:17 <LoganH> I can ice skate in my driveway
17:23:21 <LoganH> :)
17:23:25 <heidi> :-) I like to ice skate!
17:23:48 <LoganH> Me too!!!
17:24:02 <paxnovem> #info UEFI is a new interface for the BIOS. Many windows computers enable a mechanism which is suppose to provide more security, but is making our lives a bit harder. :)
17:24:32 <stoney> good info :)
17:24:33 <heidi> Ah, got it.
17:25:08 <heidi> paxnovem: So you think you've got a solution?
17:25:19 <john> Actually, UEFI is an extension of EFI, which is a replacement for BIOS (not a new interface). EFI = Extensible Firmware Interface.
17:25:48 <heidi> Ah, thanks for the clarificaiton'
17:26:15 <john> Windows 8 uses UEFI's Secure Boot, which prevents other (unsigned) operating systems from booting.
17:26:34 <john> a) the OS needs to get a key from Microsoft, or b) the user needs to disable secure boot.
17:27:02 <heidi> Ah, thanks.
17:27:06 <stoney> what a pain
17:27:14 * john nods
17:27:17 <heidi> Right! I'm not a fan of Windows!
17:27:29 <heidi> <understatement>
17:27:43 <stoney> is disabling secure boot easy?
17:27:52 <heidi> paxnovem: Do you have a USB that runs MouseTrap on any OS at all?
17:28:00 <paxnovem> #info there is a script that was designed to fix this problem for older versions of fedora. I got it working on my laptop. I haven't tested it on other laptops yet though.
17:28:07 <heidi> Ah, OK.
17:28:24 <stoney> so we have a workaround... good :)
17:29:11 <paxnovem> I have also been looking at virtual box and I can get it working reliably with an external usb webcam, but internal webcams seem a little bit more tricky
17:29:12 <john> stoney you disable Secure Boot in the EFI. It depends on the motherboard.
17:29:35 <stoney> john: that doesn't sound easy for the typical user :(
17:30:06 <heidi> paxnovem: Do you think that it is a driver issue?
17:30:10 <john> stoney but hey! If you have a Mac... no Secure Boot to worry about! *ducks*
17:30:31 <stoney> john: lucky me then :)
17:30:38 <heidi> :-)
17:30:55 <john> heidi doubt it -- likely an issue with capturing the webcam. Internal webcams can use a weird connection scheme that's not easily recognized by a VM
17:31:08 <heidi> Ah, OK.
17:31:27 <heidi> Sounds like the USB approach is more promising, if we can solve the boot issue.
17:31:45 <stoney> paxnovem: what about external-usb web-cams on a system that also has an internal webcam.... can a virtual machine be used then?
17:32:10 <paxnovem> heidi: In my testing, yes.
17:32:25 <heidi> Ah, OK
17:32:30 <paxnovem> As long as they install the oracle add on
17:32:39 <stoney> cool
17:33:13 <stoney> then I wonder if we could get a few more cheap web-cams to have on hand for the hackfest
17:33:36 <stoney> i should try the external usb thing on my laptop...
17:33:43 <stoney> that would be awesome...
17:33:53 <stoney> I could develop on my usual system
17:33:56 <heidi> I think that we could do that. We've got two in the lab.
17:34:08 <heidi> Yes, would be good to test the external USB on a variety of machines.
17:34:15 <stoney> people could share
17:34:28 <stoney> not fun, but doable
17:34:46 <heidi> If the USB approach uses the internal web cam, lots of folks would have that already.
17:35:01 <stoney> right
17:35:48 <heidi> If we wanted to be flexible (and increase the complexity) we could provide both.
17:36:05 <stoney> right... I was just trying to word that  :)
17:36:09 * heidi Notes that I'm talking about the hackfest to be held with CCSCNE in April.
17:36:18 * heidi in Providence.
17:36:21 <john> I know I'm completely out of the loop, but I'll ask anyway: why are you handling webcam connections? That should be left up to the OS
17:37:20 <stoney> john: as heidi just mentioned, we want to host a hackfest at CCSCNE in April
17:37:34 <stoney> we aren't sure what platform students will have
17:37:43 <stoney> s/students/participants/
17:37:57 <heidi> And we're assuming lots of windows machines.
17:37:57 <paxnovem> I think the live-usb will provide a better experience since many peoples laptops don't have the power to run two OS's
17:38:06 <heidi> Right.
17:38:09 <stoney> so we want to make it easy for them to get started as developers
17:38:22 <stoney> paxnovem: i agree
17:38:22 <john> ahh, got it. Carry on. :)
17:38:37 <heidi> john: So we're trying to solve the problem of how to easily get folks started on MouseTrap without having to deal with too many OS issues.
17:38:39 <heidi> :-)
17:38:52 <stoney> hopefully we can get some new developers interested in mousetrap
17:38:58 <heidi> OK, so paxnovem do you need anything from us to keep going?
17:39:09 <paxnovem> heidi: should I also create an instruction set for arm laptops/chromebooks? They are very common in the education space
17:39:38 <heidi> Umm, Not sure yet.  We have some control in that we can specify a minimum configuration for attendees.
17:40:01 <john> Fedora elevated ARM to equal footing with x86 recently
17:40:04 <john> Just saying.
17:40:05 <heidi> First let's get it running on Mac, Windows 7 and 8 and Fedora. Then lets' see.
17:40:27 <stoney> ok... what is ARM?
17:40:34 <paxnovem> Right now, I am ok, but once we come back from break I need to test my final solutions on more flash drives as different brands have nuances
17:40:37 <heidi> Good question stoney!
17:40:44 <paxnovem> ARM is a processor type
17:40:45 <heidi> Ah, sure. We can handle that.
17:40:59 <stoney> paxnovem: thanks
17:41:23 <john> stoney processor architecture (like x86, PowerPC, etc). Normally seen in mobile devices, but recently begun appearing in laptops (the said ChromeBooks) and even servers.
17:41:24 <paxnovem> it is common in phones and now tablets and cheap laptops
17:41:35 <stoney> we don't need to support multiple flash drives do we?
17:41:45 <stoney> we just need to find one that it works with
17:41:50 <stoney> and then get a bunch of those
17:41:54 <stoney> and set them up
17:41:54 <stoney> right?
17:42:17 <stoney> john: cool, thanks for the info
17:42:26 <stoney> paxnovem: you too :)
17:42:33 <heidi> Yes, right.
17:42:42 <heidi> paxnovem: Anything else?
17:42:57 <paxnovem> I think that is it from me :)
17:43:20 <heidi> kevin-brown: Are you there?
17:43:55 <heidi> john, anything to add? How have you been?
17:44:03 * stoney searching for tissues ... brb
17:44:14 <john> Nah, just about to ask if there's anything I can do to help
17:44:57 <heidi> If you'd like to download the most recent version on the gnome3-wip branch and try the patches that Logan has submitted, that would be quite helpful.
17:45:01 * heidi Looks for patch links.
17:45:41 <john> where is Mousetrap hosted on Github?
17:45:51 * stoney back
17:46:02 <LoganH> Bug 691881
17:46:02 <tota11y> 04Bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691881 normal, Normal, ---, mousetrap-maint, UNCONFIRMED, Convert OpenCV to CV 2.3.1 and update corresponding code
17:46:16 <heidi> [Bug 710775] Fix Point Mapper and [Bug 691881] Convert OpenCV to CV 2.3.1 and update corresponding code
17:46:16 <tota11y> 04Bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710775 blocker, Urgent, ---, scott123, UNCONFIRMED, Fix Point Mapper
17:46:25 <LoganH> And That one
17:46:36 <stoney> john: not on github anymore
17:46:42 <LoganH> git.gnome.org/mousetrap
17:46:47 <stoney> john: we work directly off gnome
17:46:53 <stoney> john: what LoganH  said :)
17:47:01 <LoganH> Branch is gnome3-wip
17:47:43 <john> Wow, someone randomly added a Polish translation a few months ago?
17:47:51 <stoney> yup :)
17:47:55 <stoney> awesome eh :)
17:48:04 <heidi> :-)
17:48:14 <heidi> ScottC, anything new from you?
17:50:01 * stoney testing
17:50:19 <stoney> anyone there ?
17:50:56 <LoganH> I'm thinking not
17:51:37 <ScottC> Negative
17:51:48 <stoney> aha :)
17:51:52 <heidi> :-)
17:52:01 <ScottC> Sorry if i'm not 100% attentive, quite busy at the moment :)
17:52:08 <heidi> Not a problem ScottC
17:52:21 <heidi> #topic Meeting time for spring
17:52:26 <heidi> We need to pick a meeting time for spring.
17:52:39 <heidi> Does 11:00 on Fridays generally work for everyone? Or do we need to change this?
17:52:50 * LoganH checking
17:52:53 <stoney> works for me
17:53:25 <paxnovem> *checking
17:53:44 <LoganH> No go. Theory Of Computation
17:53:49 <LoganH> 11-11:50
17:54:04 <stoney> doodle poll?
17:54:54 <john> I don't work on Fridays anymore, so Fridays would be good :)
17:55:02 <paxnovem> I can do 11, but a doodle poll is probably a good idea
17:55:04 <heidi> Or Friday at 10? Just a bit earlier?
17:55:19 <stoney> 10 works for me
17:55:24 <LoganH> 10 is good for me
17:55:55 <ScottC> Same conflict as LoganH
17:56:13 <stoney> ScottC: which means that 10 is good?
17:57:04 <heidi> kevin-brown has a class at 10.
17:57:13 <heidi> OK, we'll do a doodle poll.
17:57:15 <heidi> I'll set it up.
17:57:17 <paxnovem> I have calc 2 at 10
17:57:21 <heidi> right.
17:57:23 <heidi> :-)
17:57:29 <heidi> Anyone have anything else?
17:57:30 <LoganH> Doodle poll it is :)
17:57:33 <stoney> oops
17:57:54 <LoganH> I think I am good :)
17:58:11 <heidi> #action Create doodle poll for spring meeting time.
17:58:12 <stoney> I've got nothing :)
17:58:21 <heidi> OK, then let's call this meeting.
17:58:24 <heidi> #endmeeting