Jun 09 14:31:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So I just sent out a note officially announcing some IRC office hours this week for career stuff
Jun 09 14:32:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and now is one of them
Jun 09 14:33:47 <alpa_astero> I haven't received the email yet; how does it work?
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I'm really interested in helping you, the OPW interns, think about your
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> post-OPW career choices. Apply for a job? Start a business or nonprofit?
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Seek a grant? Go to Hacker School? Get a degree? Take some time off? If
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you don't know what to do after the internship ends, I want to help you
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> think about that and decide.
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So I'm holding IRC office hours where any of you can ask questions and
Jun 09 14:35:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> get advice, in the channel or via private message.
Jun 09 14:35:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> The first bunch is this week:
Jun 09 14:35:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * Right now and for the next 2.5 hours - till 21:00 UTC
Jun 09 14:35:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * Tomorrow (Tuesday 10 June) 12:00-14:00 UTC
Jun 09 14:35:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * Friday June 13 0:00-2:00 UTC (in North America, still Thursday June 12)
Jun 09 14:39:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (and of course some people have zero interest in this and that is FINE)
Jun 09 14:40:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi fhocutt! happy Monday.
Jun 09 14:41:04 <fhocutt> morning(ish), sumanah_wikimedia_mentor!
Jun 09 14:41:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor>
Jun 09 14:41:21 <fhocutt> needs more tea.
Jun 09 14:43:47 <fhocutt> back in a bit.
Jun 09 14:50:38 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> hi sumanah_wikimedia_mentor
Jun 09 14:50:43 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> ooh tea. that sounds like a good idea
Jun 09 14:51:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi thepwnco_wikimedia_intern!
Jun 09 14:51:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Welcome to the regular OPW channel but also the career office hours
Jun 09 14:51:44 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> thanks! I just saw the e-mail that went out
Jun 09 14:52:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor>
Jun 09 14:52:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I'm happy to chat here or privately about any career questions, ideas, etc.
Jun 09 14:52:52 <shivani> hello sumanah_wikimedia_mentor ! Great initiative just got your mail
Jun 09 14:53:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Thanks shivani! Glad to help.
Jun 09 14:53:36 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anyone: If you're trying to think of questions to ask https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen/Opportunities might help
Jun 09 14:55:15 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I see there are listed various internship opportunities here, how can one go about availing these post summer ? Since many companies seek referrals and do not really reach out to people applying via the normal career portal .
Jun 09 14:56:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: OK, I understand that some companies are like that, yeah. In general I find that it's useful to apply via the normal career portal, AND ask your personal and professional networks - including your mentor! - whether they have connections there.
Jun 09 14:57:05 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: yes, that sounds good
Jun 09 14:57:08 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: are there particular internships that are particularly interesting to you?
Jun 09 14:57:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> And after OPW, you are potentially suited to a full-time job as well
Jun 09 14:58:11 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: yes, being from a software engineering background as a part of my bachelor's degree right now, I would like to take up an internship soon
Jun 09 14:58:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: Can I ask why you would choose an internship rather than a full-time permanent position?
Jun 09 14:58:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ("permanent" in quotes, since nothing is permanent)
Jun 09 14:59:18 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: because I am also a research student (pursuing research in social computing) and I dont graduate until August 2016
Jun 09 14:59:43 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: oh I see! Thanks for clarifying and I hope I wasn't too pushy there.
Jun 09 14:59:46 <shivani> Given my research background I am also interested in potential internships in the area, say with Twitter etc
Jun 09 15:00:03 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: no not at all Thanks for being so helpful
Jun 09 15:00:37 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: So, once you've applied somewhere, then you can ask your connections to push your application forward. They'll tell the recruiters "hey this one is worth fishing out of the general pool".
Jun 09 15:01:28 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: okay. So I should probably apply and then search for respective contacts in that place
Jun 09 15:01:30 <shivani> got it
Jun 09 15:01:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: Or do it simultaneously, or search for the relevant contacts a little bit (like a few days) before putting in the formal application
Jun 09 15:02:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> but my point is, do both.
Jun 09 15:02:17 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: correct makes sense
Jun 09 15:03:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: Microsoft Research, Yahoo! Labs, and other corporate think-tanks might be good places for you to look. Also consider grants. For instance: Wikimedia's grants program https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IEG funds research sometimes Jun 09 15:04:13 * fhocutt has acquired tea
Jun 09 15:04:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Yay!
Jun 09 15:04:46 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I applied in Yahoo! Labs , but like I said the career portals dont really get back to you
Jun 09 15:04:57 <shivani> I will sure look at Wikimedia grants !
Jun 09 15:05:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: when did you apply? I know someone (very slightly) at Yahoo!.
Jun 09 15:05:32 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I wanted to work this summer, so I think a couple months ago
Jun 09 15:08:05 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: the guy I know at Yahoo! Labs is Ken Schmidt because of a few visits I had there, http://www.harihareswara.net/sumana/2010/04/07/0 and http://www.harihareswara.net/sumana/2011/03/02/1 (I never did write up Part II there and should say so in an edit)
Jun 09 15:10:39 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: wow they have a lot of academic programs (or so I feel by the look of the writeups )
Jun 09 15:11:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Those are from before the CEO changed, so, might be obsolete.
Jun 09 15:11:36 <shivani> would it be possible for you to connect my research so far with Ken Schmidt to evaluate if any opportunities may come by in the future ?
Jun 09 15:11:40 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: uh oh :P
Jun 09 15:12:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> shivani: sure - want to email me something I could forward to him?
Jun 09 15:13:40 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: absolutely I could mail you a description of what I have been involved in so far, and I'd be glad to connect for any opportunities in the near future .
Jun 09 15:13:41 <shivani>
Jun 09 15:14:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Cool. Go ahead.
Jun 09 15:14:14 <shivani> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Thanks so much for your help
Jun 09 15:14:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor>
Jun 09 15:24:30 <sasshka> evening
Jun 09 15:24:44 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi sasshka
Jun 09 15:25:49 <sasshka> is career guidance personal only? I wanted to see general advices
Jun 09 15:26:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: I can spew out general advice, sure
Jun 09 15:26:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: you might also like http://www.askamanager.org/ which is answers to other people's questions
Jun 09 15:27:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: I generally advise people to do a few things, including:
Jun 09 15:27:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * have an up-to-date curriculum vitae (also known as a CV or a resume) available somewhere public, so other people can look at it easily without having to ask you first, and can recommend you to other people
Jun 09 15:28:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * think about what you like in your internship, and ask your mentor - and me - what jobs/opportunities there are to do more of that
Jun 09 15:28:56 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and
Jun 09 15:29:40 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * apply even to jobs where you don't have all the "required" skills (maybe you have 60% of them) and apply to multiple jobs at once
Jun 09 15:30:28 <fhocutt> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor, any suggestions for how to handle multiple specialties on a general/public CV? Jun 09 15:30:30 * discoveranjali is now known as anjali_wikimedia_intern
Jun 09 15:31:14 <fhocutt> and should that generally be full of skills/keywords/etc or does that really matter if you're not submitting it to a system for screening?
Jun 09 15:32:14 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> fhocutt: So, I have my private resume (which I call the MEGA RESUME and which has like everything I have ever done that could possibly be of interest to an employer), and then I have a public resume targeted at presenting the face of myself that appeals to the jobs I most want to get
Jun 09 15:32:37 <fhocutt> ah, huh.
Jun 09 15:34:21 <sasshka> which public places are good for placing CV?
Jun 09 15:36:01 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: I put mine on my own personal website. And I have a LinkedIn account that I keep updated.
Jun 09 15:36:44 <fhocutt> how useful/necessary is LinkedIn, anyway?
Jun 09 15:37:01 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: What kind of work do you think you would be most interested in? Programming? Design? Management? Sysadmin? Something else?
Jun 09 15:37:35 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I'm interested in programming
Jun 09 15:37:58 <alpa_astero> sasshka's a fellow Libav intern, doing C
Jun 09 15:38:24 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> fhocutt: So, I think it's useful to be on LinkedIn if you actively want a job, because then recruiters can see you. But LinkedIn is also just another moneymaking machine for LinkedIn's owners and I don't TRUST it and I try to keep an eye on my privacy settings.
Jun 09 15:38:50 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I've never gotten a harassing message thorugh LinkedIn and I turn down more connection requests than I accept. I personally only accept connection requests from people I ahve actually worked with
Jun 09 15:38:51 <fhocutt> I see. I'm not used to working in a field with recruiters!
Jun 09 15:38:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> yeah!
Jun 09 15:39:07 <fhocutt> it's more the cognitive overhead of another thing to keep updated
Jun 09 15:39:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> fhocutt: right. you could set a calendar reminder to update it every 3 months
Jun 09 15:39:46 <sasshka> when I'm looking at job offers, very often more programing languages is required, I'm nervous I know only C
Jun 09 15:40:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> fhocutt: it might be worth it for you to talk with other people who have made the switch from academic-world to tech - I am thinking of people to consult
Jun 09 15:40:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: there are C jobs for sure
Jun 09 15:40:52 <alpa_astero> sasshka: this isn't job advice, but programming advice: learn a second language. Knowing at least two is a huge boost. Ruby or Python are probably the most obvious ones for someone who knows C and isn't looking to move into web stuff, imho
Jun 09 15:40:52 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> but also you could pick up a little of another language
Jun 09 15:41:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So, someone asked about WMF jobs - I work at the Wikimedia Foundation and know some things about various teams
Jun 09 15:41:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> jobs.wikimedia.org - we are hiring - we are the nonprofit behind Wikipedia. And we do hire remote people and people outside the US
Jun 09 15:41:38 <marianita> @sasshka you can learn a new language, you shouldn't be agnostic. you can find a tutorial and then contribute to an open source project :P
Jun 09 15:42:14 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marianita: what do you mean by "you shouldn't be agnostic"? Not sure I understand
Jun 09 15:42:14 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: hi sumanah! thanks for holding office hours. I am a little torn. I do want to apply for a full-time job after my internship, however, I also want to travel for a bit. but would it look very bad if for 6 months, i don’t have a normal programming job at a software company?
Jun 09 15:42:18 <marianita> ruby and python are very influential in web dev
Jun 09 15:43:05 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> hi litac. When you say "a bit" and "travel" do you mean leisure travel, and are you thinking that it would be about 6 months of travel?
Jun 09 15:43:10 <alpa_astero> marianita: yes, but they're also useful in systems programming around C, compared to something like JS or PHP; they don't exclude web dev, but they're a lot more handy on the systems and testing side
Jun 09 15:43:21 <marianita> @sumanah_wikimedia_mentor I meant that a programmer shouldn't be afraid to tackle a new programming language.
Jun 09 15:43:46 <mvolz_wikimedia_intern> It's scary to go from 1 to 2 languages, but after that it gets a lot easier
Jun 09 15:43:58 <marianita> @alpa_astero yes, they are more powerful than PHP or JS. That's the beauty of them, you can build complex systems
Jun 09 15:44:09 <mvolz_wikimedia_intern> I applied to my internship thinking I was going to write php and JS... which I don't know
Jun 09 15:44:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marianita: Ah ok. I think perhaps you meant to say that we *should* be agnostic, then. (I have made similar errors in the past)
Jun 09 15:44:21 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: it doesn’t have to be leisure. i would be willing to work remotey. But I also don’t have the connections to do that. it would be around 3 months, I woul
Jun 09 15:44:29 <marianita> yes, sorry.
Jun 09 15:44:31 <mvolz_wikimedia_intern> Ended up being Node.js, JS, and PHP and I don't know any of them!
Jun 09 15:44:32 <mvolz_wikimedia_intern>
Jun 09 15:44:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: When you say you don't have the connections to do that, do you mean the social connections?
Jun 09 15:44:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marianita: no prob
Jun 09 15:45:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> WMF stuff: you can get a snapshot of what we're up to by reading our tech blog https://blog.wikimedia.org/c/technology/
Jun 09 15:46:00 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: more like I never done contracting work before, so i don’t have a connections to start
Jun 09 15:46:20 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: you mean connections to *get the job in the first place*?
Jun 09 15:46:28 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: yes!
Jun 09 15:46:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Aha
Jun 09 15:46:42 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: the other option would just start interviewing and get a software job
Jun 09 15:46:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Well, we are part of your network
Jun 09 15:47:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> My friend Brendan got a telecommuting job and travelled a lot while he did it - I have also travelled a lot while telecommuting. Contractors and employees can both do that
Jun 09 15:48:04 <alpa_astero> a lot probably also depends on what you want to get out of the travel; travel while working and not working are fairly different experiences, even if you have schedule flexibility Jun 09 15:48:22 * alpa_astero has been traveling for the last few years
Jun 09 15:48:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> WMF stuff continued: there's a language engineering role open "Software Engineer - Internationalization" where you would be working with https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Language_engineering team, who are mostly telecommuters from various continents
Jun 09 15:49:58 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor Hi ! I'm an IT undergraduate and doing a documentation internship for Wikidata project of Wikimedia. Seek guidance for career opportunities with WMF.
Jun 09 15:50:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> WMF stuff: everything we make is open source and your code gets code review from a colleague (sometimes a volunteer community member) before it goes out onto the websites.
Jun 09 15:50:30 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: Hi there! What year will you graduate with your degree? and what are you concentrating on in your education?
Jun 09 15:51:10 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I shall be graduating aroung July 2015, majoring in Information Technology
Jun 09 15:51:26 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: I have had a gap of a year on my resume in the past. It hurt me a little bit, but I am now employed and everything's fine. I think gaps hurt a little bit but you can make up for them if you can say what you were positively doing during those periods
Jun 09 15:51:43 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: OK. Who's your mentor?
Jun 09 15:51:54 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Or, who are your mentors?
Jun 09 15:52:11 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Lydia Pintscher @nightrose
Jun 09 15:52:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: She works at Wikimedia Germany. Would you be interested in working with them in the future maybe? or other Wikimedia organizations?
Jun 09 15:53:01 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Yeah ! definitely .
Jun 09 15:53:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: Also check out http://cis-india.org/jobs
Jun 09 15:53:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> The Centre for Internet & Society (CIS) provides opportunities for students enrolled in graduate programmes to undertake internship at its office in Bengaluru. Eligible candidates are welcome to participate in our internship programme.
Jun 09 15:53:56 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: alright
Jun 09 15:54:51 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: This is a nice opportunity ! Thanks
Jun 09 15:55:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: Can you tell me more about what you find interesting about your current internship? That will help me suggest other things you might like.
Jun 09 15:56:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Also, anjali_wikimedia_intern, Nightrose is a pretty formidable open source presence herself and has a lot of connections - she will also be able to recommend ideas and options for you.
Jun 09 15:56:30 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Although my internship is a documentation internship, besides content, the codebase also is of great interest to me
Jun 09 15:56:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: have you talked with your mentors about the fact that you are interested in finding a job after the internship?
Jun 09 15:56:49 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Alright, I shall seek her advice as well.
Jun 09 15:57:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: What specific tasks have you enjoyed doing so far?
Jun 09 15:59:04 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> Exploring the tools developed for Wikidata, the extensions, trying them, exploring bugs etc.
Jun 09 15:59:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: OK. What did you like about that?
Jun 09 16:00:03 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> Overall, I like the iterative process of development and work culture of the community a lot
Jun 09 16:01:10 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: OK. So, WMF and other Wikimedia organizations definitely work iteratively and share a work culture. But there are many other open source orgs you could also consider. http://www.harihareswara.net/sumana/2014/03/06/0 has a short selected list
Jun 09 16:01:16 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: not yet
Jun 09 16:01:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: You can go ahead and do that today
Jun 09 16:01:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> so they can tell you to go to relevant conferences, mention you to their friends, and so on
Jun 09 16:02:13 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: ok
Jun 09 16:02:42 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: This looks quite useful
Jun 09 16:03:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Cool
Jun 09 16:03:41 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Will a log of this office hour be availed ?
Jun 09 16:03:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anjali_wikimedia_intern: I could put it up somewhere, sure
Jun 09 16:04:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> on the GNOME wiki
Jun 09 16:04:17 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: That would be great if done !
Jun 09 16:08:33 <litac> @sumanah_wikimedia_mentor alpa_astero thanks for your advice! it looks like there are a lot of options out there!
Jun 09 16:08:51 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> there ARE
Jun 09 16:09:12 <litac> @alpa_astero i have traveled for lesiure before, and it is not my thing. i like having something to do while going out in the weekends
Jun 09 16:09:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Apply for a job? Start a business or nonprofit? Seek a grant? Go to Hacker School? Get a degree? Take some time off? you could mix-and-match
Jun 09 16:09:33 <alpa_astero> hacker school is pretty awesome, I must say.
Jun 09 16:10:18 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: what is the process like applying for wikimedia?
Jun 09 16:10:21 <fhocutt> question about hacker school that you may not know, is it possible to defer acceptance?
Jun 09 16:10:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> fhocutt: I believe the answer is yes but you of course ought to check with HS
Jun 09 16:10:39 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: and how big are teams, even though they are remote?
Jun 09 16:10:47 <litac> alpa_astero: hacker school IS awesome!
Jun 09 16:10:54 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: so I shall answer your question partly with this https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Staff?showall=1
Jun 09 16:10:58 <fhocutt> definitely, ty
Jun 09 16:11:01 <litac> i highly recommend it!
Jun 09 16:11:05 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> some teams are, like, 2 or 3 people, and a few are much bigger
Jun 09 16:11:29 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: awesome!!! thank you!!
Jun 09 16:11:31 <litac> that is really small
Jun 09 16:11:34 <litac> that is pretty nice actually
Jun 09 16:12:14 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: applying for Wikimedia: you go through jobs.wikimedia.org and apply via the form for a job you find that is closest to what you want. in the cover letter, you mention me, and you mention that you'd be open to other jobs if there's another that's more suitable, and you mention if you've edited Wikipedia before
Jun 09 16:12:17 <himangi> What exactly is hacker School Jun 09 16:12:32 * himangi is now known as himangi_kernel_intern
Jun 09 16:12:40 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> tip: if you're gonna apply to Wikimedia Foundation, it REALLY REALLY helps if you at least try making a few little edits to Wikipedia, or upload a photo to Commons, or something.
Jun 09 16:12:52 <alpa_astero> http://hackerschool.com/ - a 3-month experience of unschooling/pursuing your technical interests, around a few dozen people doing the same thing
Jun 09 16:12:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> himangi_kernel_intern: http://hackerschool.com/ it is a place several of us have gone to improve our programming skills
Jun 09 16:13:15 <alpa_astero> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: how much of a barrier is being a very occasional contributor rather than a heavy one?
Jun 09 16:13:25 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: thanks for the tips! i will definitely do that if I apply.
Jun 09 16:13:44 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: not a barrier -- there is a huge difference between ZERO and a few.
Jun 09 16:14:09 <alpa_astero> good to know!
Jun 09 16:14:10 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: i have never edited wikipedia before though. i assume there is a tracker that has a list of things they want to change and update?
Jun 09 16:14:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: then: your application goes into a pool. The hiring manager & recruiter talk to see who is a good potential match. The recruiter sets up "phone screens" with that subset, interviewing you briefly over the phone.
Jun 09 16:14:55 <litac> sounds likea very normal interview process
Jun 09 16:15:10 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Then you generally have to do an "evaluation task" over email - they will give you a short task to do that might take an hour. Something that is a lot like something you would do in the job if you got it
Jun 09 16:15:35 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> e.g. "write tests to test this function" (tiny example)
Jun 09 16:15:54 <alpa_astero> himangi_kernel_intern: during my batch, we had a bit of a linux kernel workshop, where people asked what it did, etc, and other people answered in some detail
Jun 09 16:16:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> then it's videocalls (or in-person interviews if you are in the Bay Area) with the people you would be working with. And then, offer letter. might take 2 months
Jun 09 16:16:51 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: oh snap. i should probably start soon then if I decide to apply
Jun 09 16:17:10 <terrrydactyl> also might take a bit longer depending on whether or not wikimania or the hackathon is going on, people just tend to go on vacation during that time.
Jun 09 16:17:19 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: if you go to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Teahouse you will find people who will help you get started editing
Jun 09 16:17:38 <himangi_kernel_intern> Is it a long distance program or you have to relocate to New York?
Jun 09 16:17:43 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> himangi_kernel_intern: you relocate to NYC
Jun 09 16:17:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (for Hacker School)
Jun 09 16:18:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> himangi_kernel_intern: Please read https://www.hackerschool.com/faq Jun 09 16:18:12 * terrrydactyl hands sumanah_wikimedia_mentor a gold star for being on top of this OH
Jun 09 16:18:31 <alpa_astero> himangi_kernel_intern: feel free to message questions to me as well, if you want - I was in the same batch as Sumana
Jun 09 16:18:40 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> thank you terrrydactyl
Jun 09 16:18:53 * alpa_astero hands sumanah_wikimedia_mentor chocolate cake, too
Jun 09 16:19:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Aw thank you!
Jun 09 16:19:09 <terrrydactyl> mmm chocolate cake, sounds better than an inedible gold star
Jun 09 16:19:17 <litac> thank you so much, sumanah_wikimedia_mentor!
Jun 09 16:19:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> they are all nice things to have.
Jun 09 16:19:51 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: if you want a job *immediately after your internship ends* then yeah, applying soon is a good idea. Talk to your mentor!
Jun 09 16:19:53 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (s)
Jun 09 16:20:10 <terrrydactyl> litac: what are you working on with you OPW internship?
Jun 09 16:20:14 <terrrydactyl> your
Jun 09 16:20:20 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Lita Cho (litac), San Francisco, CA, USA - Graphical Python - Jessica McKellar
Jun 09 16:20:36 <terrrydactyl> hey, you have the same last name as me.
Jun 09 16:21:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: I do want to stress that there are a lot of other interesting places to work other than WMF where you work on open source code. http://www.harihareswara.net/sumana/2014/03/06/0 and https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen/Opportunities list some!
Jun 09 16:21:28 <litac> woah that is a lot
Jun 09 16:21:41 <litac> terrrydactyl: yes! i am working on tkinter and turtle this summer for cpython!
Jun 09 16:22:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: and of course your mentor Jessica knows MANY PEOPLE who might hire you.
Jun 09 16:22:08 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: awesome! i will definitely look around
Jun 09 16:22:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> jesstess: ^
Jun 09 16:22:42 <litac> yes! i am hoping to apply to dropbox!
Jun 09 16:22:57 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: it is crazy though. I feel like the internship started
Jun 09 16:23:06 <litac> and now we are talking about what we will do when it is over
Jun 09 16:23:22 <terrrydactyl> haha, it goes by fast
Jun 09 16:23:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: oh dear, I sure do not mean to make anyone feel pressured. it is COMPLETELY FINE to ignore job talk if you want
Jun 09 16:24:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> but it's never too early to tell your mentors that you will be wanting a job when it's over
Jun 09 16:24:21 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: no! it is totally okay! i don’t feel pressured! i feel like it is a good thing to keep in mind. didn’t realize how short 3 months really is
Jun 09 16:24:44 <alpa_astero> litac: yeah, hacker school is the same way
Jun 09 16:24:47 <himangi_kernel_intern> thanks sumanah_wikimedia_mentor and alpa_astero .. but relocating to NYC from India and bearing the living expenses is definitely not an option I have
Jun 09 16:25:04 <alpa_astero> himangi_kernel_intern: there are $5000 grants for female applicants who need it
Jun 09 16:25:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> himangi_kernel_intern: the USD 5000 grant would not help you enough?
Jun 09 16:25:26 <alpa_astero> that's enough to live in NYC, though you'll have to watch your budget, and round trip tickets should be somewhere around a thousand dollars, I'd think
Jun 09 16:25:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Some people have been able to get additional assistance himangi_kernel_intern - it is worth contacting HS to let them know that and ask whether they might have additional assistance.
Jun 09 16:25:37 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> or have tips for you.
Jun 09 16:25:52 <himangi_kernel_intern> visa+travel expenses are around 2500$
Jun 09 16:26:07 <alpa_astero> do you need a visa? it's < 3 months
Jun 09 16:26:35 <sasshka> alpa_astero: many countries needs visa to US
Jun 09 16:26:49 <himangi_kernel_intern> alpa_astero, yes a visa is required
Jun 09 16:26:59 <sasshka> sometimes it's not that easy to get it
Jun 09 16:27:15 <alpa_astero> sasshka: yes, I just don't know which offhand :/
Jun 09 16:27:19 <alpa_astero> himangi_kernel_intern: ahh
Jun 09 16:28:00 <alpa_astero> I just checked edreams.com for dehli->nyc round trip flights on two arbitrary dates; the best deal is under a thousand euros. (I don't know what city you're in, but it's unlikely to change that significantly)
Jun 09 16:28:32 <alpa_astero> I can't help on the visa side, but I'm happy to help on the finding flights side if that's relevant; finding cheap-ish flights is a hobby of mine by now
Jun 09 16:28:55 <sasshka> good hobby
Jun 09 16:29:12 <himangi_kernel_intern> alpa_astero, thats very nice of you..
Jun 09 16:29:20 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> himangi_kernel_intern: also, do you know Yuvi Panda? http://yuvi.in/blog/ He's a friend of mine who lives itinerantly in India and is interested in meeting Indian programmers who would like an HS-ish atmosphere
Jun 09 16:29:20 <himangi_kernel_intern> a great hobby indeed
Jun 09 16:29:39 <alpa_astero> himangi_kernel_intern: a half hour of doing a hobby to help out a fellow OPW intern isn't a problem.
Jun 09 16:29:56 <litac> alpa_astero: did you do hacker school as well??
Jun 09 16:30:08 <alpa_astero> yes, I was in the same batch as Sumana (who is equally awesome in person)
Jun 09 16:30:24 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> aw thank you
Jun 09 16:31:16 <himangi_kernel_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor, his blog is really interesting.. How can I contact him?
Jun 09 16:31:53 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> himangi_kernel_intern: there's a link in grey "mail me" on http://yuvi.in/ and I will pm it to you as well
Jun 09 16:36:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So, I'm here for another 25 minutes today, and then more later this week
Jun 09 16:36:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * Tomorrow (Tuesday 10 June) 12:00-14:00 UTC
Jun 09 16:36:19 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * Friday June 13 0:00-2:00 UTC (in North America, still Thursday June 12)
Jun 09 16:36:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and then more later in this round
Jun 09 16:36:40 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I also hang out here sometimes and am happy to talk when I am here.
Jun 09 16:39:30 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: thank you for your advices
Jun 09 16:41:44 <anjali_wikimedia_intern> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Thank you for this quality guidance !
Jun 09 16:43:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I am glad to help!
Jun 09 16:44:58 <terrrydactyl> i love this channel.
Jun 09 16:46:07 <terrrydactyl> i did OPW almost a 1.5 years ago and this channel always makes me happy
Jun 09 16:46:32 <alpa_astero> yay
Jun 09 16:49:24 <ali_king_wikimedia_intern> I was talking to Markus Krötzsch at SMWCon, and he mentioned Wikimedia Deutchland were looking for PHP developers
Jun 09 16:50:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ali_king_wikimedia_intern: http://wikimedia.de/wiki/Jobs
Jun 09 16:50:18 <gonyere_> Sumana you still around?
Jun 09 16:50:35 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I believe the letters at the end of the job titles are German abbreviations about the type of job
Jun 09 16:50:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> hi gonyere_!
Jun 09 16:51:10 <gonyere_> Hey!
Jun 09 16:51:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ali_king_wikimedia_intern: in Wikidata-world, in which Wikimedia Germany is the main employer, I think they employ at least one person who did not speak German when she joined - look for aude on Freenode IRC
Jun 09 16:52:03 <gonyere_> Just got your mail, thought I'd stop by and say hi
Jun 09 16:52:17 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> gonyere_: Hi there!
Jun 09 16:53:38 <gonyere_> Do you have any suggestions for landing a remote editing or marketing/ community related job related to free software?
Jun 09 16:53:57 <ali_king_wikimedia_intern> I do speak German, although I found when I visited Berlin a while back I was a little rusty!
Jun 09 16:54:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ali_king_wikimedia_intern: Nod, got it. Definitely worth reaching out to them, I figure
Jun 09 16:54:52 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> gonyere_: have you already checked out the list https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen/Opportunities ?
Jun 09 16:56:12 <gonyere_> Yeah I've applied to many of them without any response over the last couple years
Jun 09 16:57:17 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> gonyere_: OK. have you reached out to your professional network? like your old internship mentor(s)?
Jun 09 16:57:30 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> let them know what you're looking for? [some conversation with gonyere removed for length]
Jun 09 17:32:30 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> hey sumanah_wikimedia_mentor are we ok to e-mail you outside of/between IRC career guidance office hours?
Jun 09 17:32:41 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> I understand the benefit of having them open like this
Jun 09 17:32:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> thepwnco_wikimedia_intern: yes!
Jun 09 17:32:51 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> but am waiting to hear back on a few things I applied to
Jun 09 17:32:53 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sure
Jun 09 17:32:59 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> so don't have my questions just yet
Jun 09 17:32:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> emailing me is fine
Jun 09 17:33:00 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> great!
Jun 09 17:33:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sure
Jun 09 17:33:31 <thepwnco_wikimedia_intern> thanks
Jun 09 17:33:51 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Jun 10 07:50:39 * Now talking on #opw Jun 10 07:50:39 * Topic for #opw is: Internships time! Jun 10 07:50:39 * Topic for #opw set by marina at Wed Jun 4 08:50:45 2014
Jun 10 07:51:26 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi folks! The career guidance office hours "officially" start in 10 minutes, but I'm here now in case anyone wants to ask questions
Jun 10 07:52:16 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I'm Sumana Harihareswara. I'm @brainwane on Twitter & Identi.ca and I blog at http://www.harihareswara.net/ces.shtml in case you want to see me babble about tech and Star Trek and hiking.
Jun 10 07:52:26 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I'm really interested in helping you, the OPW interns, think about your post-OPW career choices. Apply for a job? Start a business or nonprofit? Seek a grant? Go to Hacker School? Get a degree? Take some time off?
Jun 10 07:52:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> If you don't know what to do after the internship ends, I want to help you think about that and decide.
Jun 10 07:52:49 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: can you review my CV?
Jun 10 07:52:54 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen/Opportunities is a good list of opportunities to start with
Jun 10 07:52:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: sure. Where is it?
Jun 10 07:54:03 <sasshka> I'm not sure where to place it
Jun 10 07:54:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: I personally put mine on my personal website.
Jun 10 07:54:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> like, harihareswara.net/firstname-lastname-resume.html
Jun 10 07:54:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> A lot of people do that
Jun 10 07:54:46 <sasshka> I don't have website
Jun 10 07:55:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: Where are you blogging?
Jun 10 07:56:00 <sasshka> blogspot
Jun 10 07:56:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Example: Kitt Hodsden http://kitt.hodsden.org/resume
Jun 10 07:56:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: You could start by putting your resume up as a blogspot post. And then you should get your own website and put it there.
Jun 10 08:01:56 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> OK! It's now 8am ET which means the career office hours have officially begun
Jun 10 08:01:58 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> so I will repeat
Jun 10 08:02:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi, I'm Sumana Harihareswara. I'm @brainwane on Twitter & Identi.ca and I blog at http://www.harihareswara.net/ces.shtml in case you want to see me babble about tech and Star Trek and hiking.
Jun 10 08:02:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I work at the Wikimedia Foundation and am a mentor in this round.
Jun 10 08:02:26 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> And I am your career development advisor. I'm really interested in helping you, the OPW interns, think about your post-OPW career choices. Apply for a job? Start a business or nonprofit? Seek a grant? Go to Hacker School? Get a degree? Take some time off?
Jun 10 08:02:29 <sasshka> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1HQq-ind6Z1RmtId3otT1ppREU/edit?usp=sharing
Jun 10 08:02:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> If you don't know what to do after the internship ends, I want to help you think about that and decide.
Jun 10 08:02:52 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I am here 12:00-14:00 UTC today and then the next office hours are Friday June 13 0:00-2:00 UTC (in North America, still Thursday June 12)
Jun 10 08:02:58 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ok sasshka - opening now.
Jun 10 08:03:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: my first bit of advice is to remove the photo
Jun 10 08:03:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: at least in the US we do not put photos of ourselves on our resumes
Jun 10 08:03:45 <sasshka> ok, I didn't know
Jun 10 08:04:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: so, some of my advice here will be from a US perspective, and I welcome European perspectives
Jun 10 08:04:47 <sasshka> I just finish my masters so I'm raw
Jun 10 08:05:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Nightrose: if you have a moment for instance, please do speak up and let us know, for instance, whether resumes/CVs for tech jobs in Europe usually include a photo, and whether they have an "objective"
Jun 10 08:06:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: you are not the first person ever to put a photo on their resume and in some industries and places I know it is normal. But in the US in tech jobs, that's not what we do
Jun 10 08:06:47 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: this is an easy-to-look-at resume and I appreciate that! you have laid it out nicely in my opinion
Jun 10 08:07:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So, in order to give you my advice, I'm first going to give you my *perspective* - as someone who has hired people for jobs. This may take a few sentences so please bear with me
Jun 10 08:09:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: When I am trying to figure out whether to bring someone in for an interview, I am looking at their resume for signals that they are (a) people who have accomplished things in the past (especially similar things to the job I am hiring for), (b) diligent and attentive to detail
Jun 10 08:09:40 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> there is a bunch of other stuff I *want* but those are two key things I can at least get some signals of from the CV
Jun 10 08:12:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: my own resume is out of date and I need to update it but here it is http://www.harihareswara.net/sumana-harihareswara-resume.txt
Jun 10 08:13:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: you see how I specify *what I have done* at each of my jobs ? also http://kitt.hodsden.org/resume . I basically think you should do that for your bachelor's thesis and master's thesis and for your research & programming experience. Explain what you did
Jun 10 08:13:34 <alpa_astero> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: whether pictures are included varies by country; in the UK, absolutely not, in France or Switzerland, it's much more common, for instance
Jun 10 08:14:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> example: "used C and R to analyze 50 terabytes of N-graph corbonium" ok I have no idea what the one-sentence here might actually be
Jun 10 08:14:11 <alpa_astero> I personally can't stand photos on resumes, and neither can my UK friends, but the norm varies by country
Jun 10 08:14:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Got it
Jun 10 08:14:57 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: you're really experienced
Jun 10 08:15:44 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: I am but even for the first projects we do when we are young, it's possible to explain what we did in a way that makes it easier for a recruiter or a hirer to see whether you've done things similar to what they are looking for
Jun 10 08:16:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I would venture to say that most of the people who will want to hire you are not scientists, and don't know what "Simulations of weak polyelectrolytes: Interplay of
Jun 10 08:16:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> acid-base equilibria, ion correlations and polymer topology" means, but they'll be able to understand if you explain what data science steps you took, and say what tools you used
Jun 10 08:17:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and then they will be able to say "aha! maybe this person could also do data science/statistical analysis for us!"
Jun 10 08:19:01 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> this leads to another thing sasshka - in your "Technical skills" section - you probably do have more skills than that. Like, have you used Git or another source control system?
Jun 10 08:19:34 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: yeah, I'm using git
Jun 10 08:19:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: then put that in there
Jun 10 08:19:53 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (there are SO MANY PEOPLE who program, but haven't ever used any source control system!)
Jun 10 08:20:46 <alpa_astero> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: related question: how do you decide what to put in/leave off? What's the threshold? I've used rcs, cvs, svn, git, mercurial, bazaar, darcs, etc, but some heavily and some a couple of times (and similar comments apply to programming languages, etc)
Jun 10 08:20:49 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Think about the tools you use, and the specific bits of the C ecosystem you are used to using. alpa_astero maybe you can think of stuff here -- like, important C libraries, or performance profiling tools, or what have you
Jun 10 08:21:00 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: OK, you are a completely different case, can I get to you later?
Jun 10 08:21:05 <alpa_astero> yes
Jun 10 08:21:30 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: "I've used a zillion things competently and am wondering what to leave off" is a different problem than what sasshka has, I think
Jun 10 08:21:53 <sasshka> indeed
Jun 10 08:22:10 <alpa_astero> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: partly, but I think there's the same "I used it once/I've used it a lot" thing to some extent
Jun 10 08:22:19 <alpa_astero> but if she disagrees, nm!
Jun 10 08:22:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: I'm gonna concentrate on sasshka right now.
Jun 10 08:22:31 <alpa_astero> yes
Jun 10 08:23:14 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: so, yeah, put Git in there. valgrind? strace? sorry I don't know C stuff. What C-related or other low-level tools and libraries and stuff have you used?
Jun 10 08:23:37 <sasshka> valgrind
Jun 10 08:23:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> in your research, or in your libav work
Jun 10 08:23:59 <sasshka> for my research I developed my own piece of software
Jun 10 08:24:12 <alpa_astero> sasshka: you'll probably end up using perf and/or oprofile by the end of the internship, too
Jun 10 08:24:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: Oh that's amazing, you should totally link to that. (the software you developed)
Jun 10 08:25:24 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: which leads me to another question. Would you be okay linking to your source code repositories? BitBucket, GitHub, similar? Because again, think from the perspective of a manager who wants to hire you. They would love to be able to skim past code you wrote
Jun 10 08:25:44 <sasshka> some of my code is already at GitHub
Jun 10 08:25:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> lots of programmers out there do not have ANY code available for the public to see, so you, by showing your code, put yourself ahead of them
Jun 10 08:26:02 <sasshka> but it's only libav work, not research
Jun 10 08:26:19 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: is there already a link to your GitHub somewhere on your CV? if so, I've missed it and you need to make it more prominent
Jun 10 08:27:00 <sasshka> no, it's not there yet
Jun 10 08:27:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: OK. Add it.
Jun 10 08:27:13 <sasshka> ok
Jun 10 08:27:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: in "Research and programming experience" I guess
Jun 10 08:28:17 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: Once you've added that, it'll be easier for people like me to look at it and help you add more items to your list of technical skills. Where is the code you wrote for your research? If possible you should put it on your GitHub
Jun 10 08:29:35 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: reasearch code is on university computer, I'm not sure if it can be public before publication
Jun 10 08:30:17 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: OK, then you should briefly describe the code - "5,000 line C program that does foo with bar: code available upon request, will be published along with research results"
Jun 10 08:31:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: also, IMO it does not hurt to ask your advisor(s) and double-check, so you CAN be sure that you will be able to publish it, under an open source license, once the research is published
Jun 10 08:31:48 <sasshka> ok, I'll ask my superviser about it
Jun 10 08:32:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> if other scientists in your particular field are using a particular open source license (e.g., the MIT license, the Apache licence, the GPL), just use that, basically, as that will make it easiest for them to build on your work and incorporate it into theirs, in my opinion
Jun 10 08:32:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (as long as it's a real open source license of course! http://opensource.org/licenses )
Jun 10 08:34:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: having an "objective" is useful -- for yourself and for recruiters and employers, to help them see what you are looking for, and to help you narrow down your search. Are you looking for a job where you can mix programming and science? a job where you know your work will affect a lot of people? an environment that encourages learning? I know this is hard to think about
Jun 10 08:35:16 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> it's also ok to have an objective that's just "a full-time job as a software developer in [place]"
Jun 10 08:35:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> [place] can be a set of places e.g., "Europe, North America, or Australia"
Jun 10 08:36:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: but as you learn and grow and have more programming experience and more job experiences, you will learn what is important to you, and see what you want in your next role. Does that make sense?
Jun 10 08:37:01 <sasshka> yeah
Jun 10 08:37:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> This is an iterative process. Your CV will grow and change over time
Jun 10 08:37:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: "Participation at conferences" - did you speak at all those conferences?
Jun 10 08:37:35 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: no
Jun 10 08:37:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: did you speak at any of them?
Jun 10 08:37:44 <sasshka> only participated
Jun 10 08:38:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> OK. What does participation mean? What specifically did you do? I may be misunderstanding, because I have not been to science conferences
Jun 10 08:39:30 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I just was there, listened to speaches, I was young that time
Jun 10 08:39:43 <sasshka> didn't have my software developed
Jun 10 08:40:36 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: ok. So when you went to FOSDEM and the VideoLAN dev days, what did you do? did you hack on anything?
Jun 10 08:41:20 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: when I was at FOSDEM I was working on my first demuxer, but it's not finished yet
Jun 10 08:41:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> OK. So in my opinion you should leave that section out, if you are applying for programmer jobs. But! Soon you will start speaking at conferences. And then you should put in a section about talks and presentations you have given.
Jun 10 08:42:30 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: so, you have some suggestions from me. Do you want to fix up your CV now, with those suggestions, and then show it to me again?
Jun 10 08:42:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (back in a few minutes)
Jun 10 08:43:29 <sasshka> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: thank you a lot, I'll show you updated version in your next irc office hours
Jun 10 08:51:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> sasshka: great!
Jun 10 08:52:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> lyndsey: hey there, just a quick question, did you talk with the recruiter from Robert Half? it might be a good idea to let her know how you're doing and that you'll be looking for fulltime work starting in late August
Jun 10 08:52:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: ok, so, on the question of the skill threshold, and what to leave off
Jun 10 08:53:17 <lyndsey> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Sure, I will shoot her an email
Jun 10 08:53:31 <lyndsey> That sounds like a good idea.
Jun 10 08:54:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> lyndsey: good yeah, she'll be more able to place you after OPW I think
Jun 10 08:55:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: so, it's ok to have, like, different sections in the Skills list. "Fluent" "skilled" "some proficiency"
Jun 10 08:55:42 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> alpa_astero: and then you can dump lots and lots of things in there. Languages, tools
Jun 10 08:57:01 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you ( alpa_astero ) I know can link to a bunch of code you have written in various languages and modes, which makes it less important to spell out the ecologies you've worked in (e.g., a Java person who can't link to code they've written ought to also specify which bits of Java they've worked with -- Spring, portlets, J2EE apps, etc etc)
Jun 10 08:58:29 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> but basically alpa_astero in terms of a resume/CV you are super unusual among OPW interns because you have so much open source experience, so my advice to you will be very unusual as well -- look at the resumes of the people you are working with and ask your friends what they do for more data points
Jun 10 09:03:19 <alpa_astero> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: ahh, good points. Thank you for patiently spelling things out for me.
Jun 10 09:03:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor>
Jun 10 09:03:31 <sasshka> alpa_astero: too much cool CV
Jun 10 09:05:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So I'm open to other questions & concerns & CV/resume reviews
Jun 10 09:06:25 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I am here till 14:00 UTC today (another hour basically) and then the next office hours are Friday June 13 0:00-2:00 UTC (in North America, still Thursday June 12)
Jun 10 09:22:47 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I'll mention again https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen/Opportunities as a starting point for looking for jobs in open source - you can of course also start a business or nonprofit, seek a grant, choose to further your education, take time off, or do something else
Jun 10 09:46:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi Niharika - hope you're doing well.
Jun 10 09:47:32 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Hi. How are you?
Jun 10 09:47:35 <Niharika> I am doing well.
Jun 10 09:47:54 <Niharika> Gearing up for my first trip to States. And OSB.
Jun 10 09:48:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Woohoo! I'll get to meet you!
Jun 10 09:48:52 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Me too.
Jun 10 09:48:54 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: So, how are you preparing -- that is, specifically, to make this a trip that's good for your career?
Jun 10 09:49:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (this is the career office hours so I may as well focus on that)
Jun 10 09:50:35 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I have only just started preparing the talk. Was under a lot of work stress till now. This trip is definitely important for my career. I´ll get to meet wonderful people and make new connections.
Jun 10 09:50:51 <Niharika> And I hope to repeat the experience next year as well.
Jun 10 09:51:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: it's possible to prepare for the trip in a way that improves the chances you will meet and make connections with people who will be good for your career
Jun 10 09:51:44 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: and to improve the chances you can go again next year
Jun 10 09:53:03 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Any tips on how should I prepare for the trip? Also, about the talk, is it okay if I go a bit off-topic? I´d like to mention about OPW and the experience I had as well.
Jun 10 09:53:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: let's talk about trip prep first, and then talk about your Open Source Bridge presentation
Jun 10 09:53:43 <Niharika> Okay!
Jun 10 09:54:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: http://infotrope.net/2009/10/15/ten-tips-for-tech-conference-attendees/ is useful
Jun 10 09:54:26 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: BUSINESS CARDS. BRING THEM. Even flimsy paper ones are better than none.
Jun 10 09:54:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Yes You Should Have Business Cards: Left-justify your name and web address and email address -- no title necessary -- in a legible font. Get the perforated cardstock and do it on a home printer, or get a local copy shop to make them for like $20 for a hundred cards. Black type on white non-glossy paper is great; that way it's easy for the other person to write on it to remember where they met you and why they want to follo
Jun 10 09:54:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> w up with you.
Jun 10 09:54:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Carry them with you. Put a few in your wallet. If you feel silly about it, think of it as an act of hospitality. You're making life easier for people like me.
Jun 10 09:55:13 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> that cut-off bit was: "remember where they met you and why they want to follow up with you."
Jun 10 09:55:31 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Oh. Okay. I´ll get some printed.
Jun 10 09:55:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: Are you on Twitter?
Jun 10 09:55:49 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Yes. But not very active.
Jun 10 09:56:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: it's ok not to be very active
Jun 10 09:56:52 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2014/sessions - have you already marked, with a favorite/star, sessions you would like to attend?
Jun 10 09:56:58 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: What kind of an audience should I be expecting at the conference?
Jun 10 09:57:01 <Niharika> No, not yet.
Jun 10 09:57:03 <Niharika> Will do.
Jun 10 09:57:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: I will get to that later
Jun 10 09:57:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: yes, do that before you leave for the conference - that way, the schedule http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2014/schedule will be already marked with the stars, to remind you of what you want to see.
Jun 10 09:58:15 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I saw the schedule. There are so many clashing talks I´d like to attend!
Jun 10 09:58:43 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: that's always the case at a good conference. Fav-star even conflicting ones. At least then that reduces your choices to 2 instead of 6 to make it easier for you to choose
Jun 10 09:58:54 <Niharika> Yeah.
Jun 10 09:59:16 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Also Niharika look at the list of speakers. http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2014/speakers If there's anyone you really want to meet, if they have a Twitter account, follow them on Twitter and maybe even mention them in a Tweet like @brainwane looking forward to seeing your Python tips talk at #osbridge !
Jun 10 10:00:00 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay. Nice idea. I´ll go through the list.
Jun 10 10:00:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: Yes. They will be happy to know that someone is looking forward to their talk. And it marks you as - to them - having good taste.
Jun 10 10:00:55 <Niharika> Good for building connections.
Jun 10 10:01:10 <Niharika> I feel like a spider building a web.
Jun 10 10:01:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you could even say (briefly) specifically WHY you want to see their talk, e.g., "I especially am curious to hear your perspective on foo" or "My MediaWiki work has made me curious about bar"
Jun 10 10:01:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> that makes you more memorable
Jun 10 10:02:19 <Niharika> Ah, okay. I see.
Jun 10 10:02:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: as Skud says in http://infotrope.net/2009/10/15/ten-tips-for-tech-conference-attendees/ , "try to post a couple of particularly interesting things on your blog in the weeks or days before the conference, so that when people go look at your site they find something worthwhile there. If you’ve got things you want to talk to people about at the conference (such as a new software release), that’s an ideal topic
Jun 10 10:02:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> to post about."
Jun 10 10:02:35 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> "that’s an ideal topic to post about."
Jun 10 10:03:20 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay, got it. I´ll write a post about what I´m gonna talk about.
Jun 10 10:03:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> even just 1 post - yeah
Jun 10 10:04:37 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: ok. So, the kinds of people who will be at Open Source Bridge: lots and lots of programmers, some designers and marketers and testers and systems administrators and managers and hardware-makers and editors/writers and so on. Almost everyone there is very used to using and contributing to open source software
Jun 10 10:05:10 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: That is pretty big!
Jun 10 10:05:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> it is fine to assume that your audience is all people who have contributed to open source software before
Jun 10 10:05:44 <Niharika> Okay. So I can skip the very basic stuff.
Jun 10 10:05:49 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I don't know the exact number of attendees but it is maybe 400? 500 people?
Jun 10 10:05:50 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> yes
Jun 10 10:06:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you will get maybe 10-35 people attending your talk
Jun 10 10:06:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> http://opensourcebridge.org/sessions/1250
Jun 10 10:06:51 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay.
Jun 10 10:07:16 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay. So firstly, should I discuss the code in detail or no?
Jun 10 10:07:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Well, let's look at your aim - what you want the audience to walk away understanding, knowing, or believing
Jun 10 10:07:53 <Niharika> I think it´ll be boring. If someone is coming for this talk, they´re coming to hear the reason and logic behind it.
Jun 10 10:08:01 <Niharika> Yeah.
Jun 10 10:08:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I think it's fine to briefly show some sample code, and to mention where they could see the rest.
Jun 10 10:09:25 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay. I´ll maybe highlight some key function to show them how it runs.
Jun 10 10:09:29 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Do you plan on having slides? It is ok to have slides or not have slides, but since you are talking about a specific interactive part of a web site, it will probably help to show it off in some way. You could load it up in your browser, and have several tabs open, and show it that way
Jun 10 10:10:45 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Yeah, I was planning to have slides. I was thinking of taking screenshots of the feature and incorporating it in the slides itself.
Jun 10 10:10:56 <Niharika> Should I do an actual demo instead?
Jun 10 10:11:20 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: What are you trying to teach/show, and what would explain it better?
Jun 10 10:12:30 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> If you're trying to show interaction, then a live demo is probably better.
Jun 10 10:12:38 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I am trying to show them how an article with 300 languages is better off with just nine of their choice. The demo would be better, I think. Will I be having WiFI connectivity in the conference?
Jun 10 10:12:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> But of course you have to practice it.
Jun 10 10:12:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Yes, Open Source Bridge has reliable WiFi.
Jun 10 10:12:54 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (it is an unusual conference in this way)
Jun 10 10:13:08 <Niharika> I could show it on Wikipedia itself. It´s a live Beta Feature.
Jun 10 10:13:13 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> COOOOOL. Yes.
Jun 10 10:13:25 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> There is a "whoooa" factor when people see something is live on Wikipedia RIGHT NOW.
Jun 10 10:13:27 <Niharika> I am sure that will generate some interest and they´ll probably go and try their hands on it.
Jun 10 10:13:30 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> yes!
Jun 10 10:13:36 <Niharika>
Jun 10 10:13:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Here are some thoughts on slides: http://headrush.typepad.com/creating_passionate_users/2005/06/kill_your_prese.html
Jun 10 10:14:21 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> btw is Sucheta co-presenting with you? if so and if she's awake and available, bring her in here
Jun 10 10:14:21 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I was also a bit concerned that I might not have enough stuff to talk about for 45 minutes.
Jun 10 10:14:49 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: For a 45-minute talk slot I always try to make my talk 30 minutes, so that there are 15 minutes for Q&A.
Jun 10 10:15:11 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: She hasn´t been in touch. She told me she won´t be able to make it most probably.
Jun 10 10:15:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Oh that's too bad.
Jun 10 10:15:28 <Niharika> Okay, that´s relieving then.
Jun 10 10:15:35 <Niharika> 30 minutes should be fine.
Jun 10 10:15:52 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I think you will have enough for 30 minutes.
Jun 10 10:16:01 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Things the OSB audience does not know necessarily include:
Jun 10 10:16:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * that the people who write Wikipedia in different languages are actually writing in character sets that they cannot directly access from their keyboard
Jun 10 10:16:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * that none of this is machine translation
Jun 10 10:17:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * that some of these languages are right-to-left
Jun 10 10:17:42 <Niharika> Okay. That could make for some interesting fun facts.
Jun 10 10:17:43 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * what it looks like to be logged into Wikipedia (as opposed to anonymous)
Jun 10 10:18:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * the fact that if you log in you can turn on certain beta features
Jun 10 10:18:46 <Niharika> Okay,
Jun 10 10:19:02 <Niharika> I´ll make sure to highlight these points.
Jun 10 10:19:03 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * what OPW is (it's easiest to explain it as a paid mentorship/internship program that helps women get into contributing to open source, and you can mention that there was just a session about it earlier in the day)
Jun 10 10:19:05 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: no!
Jun 10 10:19:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: I am not telling you to highlight these points!
Jun 10 10:19:17 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: don't assume that either!
Jun 10 10:19:37 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: But you said the OSB audience does not know these points?
Jun 10 10:19:44 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: I am telling you some things that they don't know. YOU decide, as you are preparing your talk, what they need to know/understand in order to understand the things you want them to understand
Jun 10 10:20:04 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay. Got it.
Jun 10 10:20:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> for instance, it might not be relevant to them that none of this is machine translation
Jun 10 10:20:22 <Niharika> Yeah.
Jun 10 10:20:53 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> this is kind of like dependency management. I am telling you some things that are or are not installed on their "machines" (brains). you have to think through what dependencies your "package" (presentation) has
Jun 10 10:21:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and install only the ones you need, or that you can make entertaining
Jun 10 10:21:37 <Niharika> Understood. I highlight points which are relevant for my project.
Jun 10 10:22:00 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Cool.
Jun 10 10:22:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: ok, I'm gonna go on and tell you things many of the people at OSB don't know.
Jun 10 10:22:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * how to edit Wikipedia
Jun 10 10:22:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * that there's more to Wikimedia than Wikipedia -- Commons, Wikidata, Wikivoyage, etc.
Jun 10 10:23:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * Wikipedia Zero Jun 10 10:23:24 * Niharika googles Wikipedia Zero
Jun 10 10:23:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * how to figure out what language Wikipedia you want when browsing from a mobile device/tablet
Jun 10 10:23:50 <Niharika> Ah.
Jun 10 10:24:08 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Wikipedia_Zero
Jun 10 10:24:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * how many languages we support - where there are very few openly licensed fonts
Jun 10 10:25:23 <Niharika> Yeah. I would highlight this.
Jun 10 10:25:29 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * how many of our users ONLY speak one language versus multiple languages
Jun 10 10:26:10 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * what Beta Features is and how we use it to try out new stuff before rolling it out to everyone
Jun 10 10:26:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * the fact that we try new stuff on different wikis in stages (like, small wikis first, wikis that express interest first, etc.)
Jun 10 10:27:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> * how few sysadmins and paid developers we have compared to the size of our site/impact
Jun 10 10:28:36 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So, that's of course a selection of the things they don't know. if you are wondering whether they will or won't know a specific fact/idea, feel free to ping me or the speaker organizers at OSB to ask
Jun 10 10:28:48 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay!
Jun 10 10:28:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> You asked whether it's ok to go a bit off topic and talk about OPW and your experience.
Jun 10 10:29:08 <Niharika> Yeah.
Jun 10 10:29:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> It depends. Tell me what you'd like to say and why you think this audience ought to hear it
Jun 10 10:31:04 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I was thinking about how I´ll begin. I would like to tell about my experience with the Wikimedia community in general, and about what a great initiative OPW is for bringing women into open source.
Jun 10 10:31:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> That's not what this audience came for
Jun 10 10:31:43 <Niharika> Yeah. So I should dive into the project straight away?
Jun 10 10:32:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you have a six-point outline in your abstract. is there a reason not to use it?
Jun 10 10:32:58 <Niharika> No, none. I will plan the talks according to that then.
Jun 10 10:33:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> In "4. How we implemented the feature" you could briefly talk about how you came to work on this specific project, and summarize your Wikimedia experience, especially things that surprised you. And you can say a sentence or two about how OPW is why this project got implemented and why you're at OSB at all.
Jun 10 10:33:55 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay. And does the speaker usually introduce himself/herself at the talk?
Jun 10 10:34:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: At Open Source Bridge, there is a volunteer in the room who introduces you. That volunteer says basically 2 sentences: "you are in room 101 for the talk "doing foo with bar" and your speakers are Name1 and Name2. Please welcome Name1 and Name2." (audience applauds)
Jun 10 10:34:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and then you start
Jun 10 10:35:09 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay.
Jun 10 10:35:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> so if you have more info you want people to know about you straightaway then you would say it at the start
Jun 10 10:35:21 <Niharika> Okay.
Jun 10 10:36:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> the exception is the morning keynote speeches, which basically everyone at the conference attends and which are in a separate auditorium - like, you've seen the video for my speech "Be Bold: An Origin Story"? One of the conference organizers introduces each keynote speaker with a paragraph about them
Jun 10 10:36:49 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> "Sumana Harihareswara has done foo and bar and baz, she has these degrees, she has this title and that title, and we are excited to hear her talk. Please welcome Sumana"
Jun 10 10:36:51 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (applause)
Jun 10 10:37:01 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Ah, no. I haven´t seen the video. Will I find it on YouTube? Jun 10 10:37:01 * mindy applauds
Jun 10 10:37:05 <Niharika>
Jun 10 10:37:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> hahahahaha thank you mindy
Jun 10 10:37:28 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: yeah, the video is on YouTube. also you can read it
Jun 10 10:37:37 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> http://opensourcebridge.org/wiki/2012/Keynote_by_Sumana_Harihareswara https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OczqFEcUTA
Jun 10 10:37:48 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> speech begins at 6:01
Jun 10 10:38:03 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay!
Jun 10 10:38:20 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you are not obligated to watch that talk
Jun 10 10:38:52 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I would like to. I´ll come to know of what sort of an environment to expect and how to keep everyone engaged.
Jun 10 10:38:54 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ok, so, do you have some more questions about your talk, or shall we talk more about networking at the conference?
Jun 10 10:39:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: no no no, my talk is not a good guide for your talk
Jun 10 10:39:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> my talk is meant for a different purpose
Jun 10 10:39:36 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay.
Jun 10 10:40:09 <Niharika> No, no more questions about talk.
Jun 10 10:40:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you can download audio from last year's sessions - look at http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2013/schedule and click through to things that sound a little like your talk
Jun 10 10:40:31 <Niharika> Okay!
Jun 10 10:40:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> like, other things that, like yours, are in the Chemistry track http://opensourcebridge.org/events/2013/tracks/27
Jun 10 10:41:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> " Using Secure Boot for the powers of good" or "What Is Async, How Does It Work, And When Should I Use It?"
Jun 10 10:41:25 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> or "FirefoxOS"
Jun 10 10:41:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I didn't go to those I think but they seem kind of like your talk
Jun 10 10:41:45 <Niharika> Yeah, they do. I´ll listen in.
Jun 10 10:41:47 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ok, so, networking at the conference in a way that helps you with your career
Jun 10 10:43:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> giving a good talk helps. And putting your slide deck & other notes online very soon after your talk (the same day is good), and linking to them on the conference wiki that day as well
Jun 10 10:43:52 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> example: http://opensourcebridge.org/wiki/2012/Outreach_Events%3A_My_Triumphs%2C_My_Mistakes is linked to ("session notes") on http://opensourcebridge.org/sessions/758 and it is the place where you put text notes or link to your slide deck/other resources (GitHub repositories, etc.)
Jun 10 10:44:10 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Okay. I hope to give a good talk.
Jun 10 10:44:12 <Niharika> Okay.
Jun 10 10:44:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> this helps people see your work and pass it around and forward it to other people so they can also be impressed
Jun 10 10:44:59 <Niharika> Okay.
Jun 10 10:45:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> At the conference, you can meet anyone - you can talk to any stranger. They have a lot in common with you and will be okay with you introducing yourself and starting a conversation
Jun 10 10:45:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you can say something like "Hi, how are you?" and they will say "fine" and you can say "this is my first time at OSB, what talks are you looking forward to?" and that can start the conversation
Jun 10 10:45:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> or "what sorts of things do you work on?"
Jun 10 10:46:09 <Niharika> Okay.
Jun 10 10:46:16 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> it is ok if it is a little stilted at first. People like to talk about the things they are interested in and will usually relax
Jun 10 10:48:07 <Niharika> Okay.
Jun 10 10:48:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I have a few starter and restarter questions at the ready, e.g., "what is your talk about" if they are wearing a badge that is marked "speaker", or "have you been in open source a long time?"
Jun 10 10:48:14 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I enthusiastically listen and ask follow-up questions and bring up related topics and trivia.
Jun 10 10:48:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Some people respond in kind and get the momentum of the conversation going, start new threads and return to old ones. Some don't. If after five minutes of that treatment the person isn't saying anything particularly interesting, I say, "will you excuse me" and say something about food or drink or something, go away, and find some other person to talk to.
Jun 10 10:48:38 <Niharika> I am good at listening, not so much at speaking though.
Jun 10 10:48:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I almost always find someone who can do twenty interesting minutes with me. And now I've made a new acquaintance, probably a friend. If I now need to mingle more to get good return on investment out of the event, I frankly say, "I need to go mingle and meet more people," take her card or give him mine, and move on.
Jun 10 10:49:24 <Niharika>
Jun 10 10:49:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Niharika: what helps you feel comfortable and speak more?
Jun 10 10:50:28 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Usually when the other person is actually interested in talking to me and asks interesting stuff, I speak more. Otherwise I usually listen.
Jun 10 10:51:05 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> there is a virtuous circle, where saying interesting things causes other people to become interested and to ask interesting questions
Jun 10 10:51:35 <Niharika> Yeah.
Jun 10 10:51:49 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Is it normal to hand out my card to anyone I meet at the conference?
Jun 10 10:51:59 <Niharika> Anyone I get acquaninted with, I mean.
Jun 10 10:52:00 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> if you have talked to them for ~5 minutes, yes
Jun 10 10:52:06 <Niharika> acquainted*
Jun 10 10:52:12 <Niharika> Okay.
Jun 10 10:52:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> you can say "do you have a card?" and start it that way
Jun 10 10:52:48 <Niharika> Okay, sounds better.
Jun 10 10:53:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and it is fine to listen a lot
Jun 10 10:53:56 <Niharika>
Jun 10 10:53:58 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> especially the first day
Jun 10 10:54:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> if that makes you feel more comfortable
Jun 10 10:54:26 <Niharika> Yeah.
Jun 10 10:54:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> another way to start conversations is to go to talks and talk to the speaker after, asking them followup questions
Jun 10 10:55:00 <Niharika> Okay, I see.
Jun 10 10:56:17 <Niharika> Thanks for all the great advice sumanah_wikimedia_mentor.
Jun 10 10:56:25 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Glad to help Niharika
Jun 10 10:56:56 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> also Niharika people will and should respect your wishes. If you want to eat vegetarian, if you want to drink alcohol or not drink alcohol, if you want to go or not go to a specific talk, that is your choice
Jun 10 10:57:19 <Niharika> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: Understood.
Jun 10 10:57:36 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (the drinking age in the US is 21 so people under that age should not drink, even if there is alcohol available)
Jun 10 10:58:00 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> but that is general advice that is not really about networking/career
Jun 10 10:58:17 <Niharika> I am above 21. But I don´t usually drink.
Jun 10 10:58:23 <Niharika>
Jun 10 11:03:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ok, I'm gonna ask if anyone else has career-related questions
Jun 10 11:03:10 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anyone else?
Jun 10 11:08:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> the next office hours are Friday June 13 0:00-2:00 UTC (in North America, still Thursday June 12)
Jun 10 11:19:16 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> OK! I'm calling this over. I'll be around and you can talk to me but the office hour today is over
Jun 10 11:19:17 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> the next office hours are Friday June 13 0:00-2:00 UTC (in North America, still Thursday June 12)
Jun 12 19:59:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Welcome to OPW career advice office hours!
Jun 12 19:59:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi, I'm Sumana Harihareswara. I'm @brainwane on Twitter & Identi.ca and I blog at http://www.harihareswara.net/ces.shtml in case you want to see me babble about tech and Star Trek and hiking.
Jun 12 20:00:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I work at the Wikimedia Foundation and am a mentor in this round.
Jun 12 20:00:15 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I'm really interested in helping you, the OPW interns, think about your post-OPW career choices. Apply for a job? Start a business or nonprofit? Seek a grant? Go to Hacker School? Get a degree? Take some time off?
Jun 12 20:00:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> If you don't know what to do after the internship ends, I want to help you think about that and decide.
Jun 12 20:00:43 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> So for the next 2 hours, please feel free to ask questions, here or in private message.
Jun 12 20:01:08 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Since other interns have requested it, I will be posting channel logs from this chat, along with those from the office hours earlier this week, on the GNOME wiki.
Jun 12 20:01:55 <litac> will you have these again later on in the internship?
Jun 12 20:01:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> yes
Jun 12 20:02:47 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I can review CVs/resumes, talk about jobs on this list https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen/Opportunities , etc Jun 12 20:11:54 * sumanah_wikimedia_mentor drinks rooibos tea
Jun 12 20:15:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> karen: hey, you around? I saw that http://linux.conf.au/cfp is open and I know you've gone to linux.conf.au
Jun 12 20:21:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: yeah this is pretty different from the last time.
Jun 12 20:21:20 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I know x_x so quiet
Jun 12 20:21:31 <litac> i got my job questions answered
Jun 12 20:21:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Cool!
Jun 12 20:21:38 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: do you also work remotely?
Jun 12 20:21:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: you've talked with your mentor a bit about your job/career plans?
Jun 12 20:22:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Yes I work remotely; my headquarters is in San Francisco and my team includes people in SF, Toulouse, Prague.....
Jun 12 20:22:17 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: a little bit. she asked if i wanted to apply at dropbox. i told her i was definitely intersted and touch back with me in July
Jun 12 20:22:34 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: do you have a co-working spcae or do you work mostly at home?
Jun 12 20:22:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Hi Queeniebee! you're here and it's the last career advice office hour of the week
Jun 12 20:23:23 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: I definitely work from home sometimes, like if I have a bunch of voice/video meetings. But Wikimedia Foundation pays for a membership in a coworking space. And sometimes I cowork with friends or at aligned organizations, like tech nonprofits
Jun 12 20:23:26 <Queeniebee> Hi Sumanah_wikimedia_mentor!
Jun 12 20:24:22 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I should ask her about other opportuniites like startups at stuff. but i need time to reflect what i want
Jun 12 20:24:26 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: I should have guessed she would mention Dropbox as a possibility.
Jun 12 20:24:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> right
Jun 12 20:24:39 <litac> working remote is hard though as I miss working with people.
Jun 12 20:24:51 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> do you have some frameworks or principles guiding you litac? in figuring out what you want next in your career?
Jun 12 20:24:52 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: haha yes. i think she wants to push that pretty hard
Jun 12 20:25:47 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> yeah, the coworking space is very good for me, and I also visit SF regularly. I need alone time to recharge but I also need people time personally.
Jun 12 20:26:08 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: yes. i definitely want to work in web. ideally i would love to continue to work in python. I am open though. i came from the corporate world, and I would prefer not to work at a place too big just yet
Jun 12 20:26:55 <litac> i also would love flexible hours. my hours were really rigid beforfe
Jun 12 20:26:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Have you seen this diagram litac? http://whatconsumesme.com/2009/posts-ive-written/how-to-be-happy-in-business-venn-diagram/ What we do well, what we can be paid to do, what we want to do
Jun 12 20:27:30 <Queeniebee> I have a question: are we taking turns asking Sumana questions?
Jun 12 20:27:31 <litac> No!
Jun 12 20:27:39 <litac> you should just ask
Jun 12 20:27:50 <litac> Queeniebee: sumanah_wikimedia_mentor is awesome at multi-tasking!
Jun 12 20:27:50 <Queeniebee> Okay litac
Jun 12 20:27:59 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: I started a miscellaneous spontaneous conversation with litac in case that would get people talking - perhaps it backfired
Jun 12 20:28:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> anyone should feel free to ask a question or mention a concern
Jun 12 20:28:20 <litac> hahahaha it was really quiet beforfe
Jun 12 20:28:41 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I have NEVER seen this! this is really insightful! thanks for sharing!
Jun 12 20:28:46 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> IT IS. I LOVE IT.
Jun 12 20:29:02 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I mean, all models are oversimplified and wrong in some ways. But this is helpful in a lot of ways
Jun 12 20:29:16 <Queeniebee> One of the big questions I have is how to present the skills I am learning from the internship that marries previous skills
Jun 12 20:29:18 <litac> i need to write my skills in this way and find out what i want to do
Jun 12 20:29:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: nod, nod nod. Good question. People who are multitalented often have this problem
Jun 12 20:30:19 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: so, this is sort of a question of presentation and narrative. How do you present yourself to someone else so they look at your path and say "oh cool" rather than being confused. Right?
Jun 12 20:30:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and see how your skills complement each other and work together
Jun 12 20:30:34 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Right?
Jun 12 20:30:38 <Queeniebee> Yes yes
Jun 12 20:31:00 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ok. So one part of this is that we are going to simplify in different ways for different audiences
Jun 12 20:32:08 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> example: if you are applying for a job that needs a lot of interpersonal and writing skills, you can write a resume that emphasizes those and leaves out others. If you're applying for a job that's a much less interpersonal job, more about you communing with a codebase all day, then you can add some skills & leave others out
Jun 12 20:32:29 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I personally have a "MEGARESUME" that I have on my computer, for my own personal use, that I can dip into like a pool
Jun 12 20:33:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> that - if it's updated, and I haven't updated it in a few years now - has all the things I have been/done/gotten, jobs, education, awards, speeches & talks, volunteer experience
Jun 12 20:33:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> and then when I apply for jobs, I make a few different versions
Jun 12 20:33:58 <alpa_astero> That's a really awesome idea
Jun 12 20:34:06 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> manager-sumana. writer-sumana. coder-sumana. teacher-sumana. These are different faces of me and each resume includes some things and leaves others out
Jun 12 20:34:19 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> the title for the Work Experience section (for me) is "Selected Work Experience"
Jun 12 20:34:37 <Queeniebee> I've been underemployed since I graduated college and the impressive items are Mozilla, another internship
Jun 12 20:34:38 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> because I have enough in my past, now, that there's no way it's all relevant to every job!
Jun 12 20:35:08 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: but you have made things - projects.
Jun 12 20:35:36 <Queeniebee> Yes I have
Jun 12 20:35:57 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Those count IMO as experience. You can even call the section "Experience" rather than "Work Experience" if you want
Jun 12 20:36:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ("IMO" = "In my opinion" for those of you who don't see abbreviations regarding humility too often on the net)
Jun 12 20:36:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: is http://fleurantin.cc/about/ up to date? you are a master's candidate?
Jun 12 20:37:35 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: so, I can help you do some wordsmithing to connect your older and newer skills - do you have a current version of a CV/resume up somewhere?
Jun 12 20:37:37 <Queeniebee> So when transistioning put projects first
Jun 12 20:37:54 <Queeniebee> Yes my website is up to date but needs work
Jun 12 20:39:13 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: I don't want to say "when transitioning put projects first" as a general rule; it's just that for you, your projects are probably a strong part of your experience and I think you should include them. We usually in resumes have experience in reverse chronological order - Most Recent first - so your internship would go first
Jun 12 20:40:08 <Queeniebee> I'm on my phone and don't remember the address of my resume
Jun 12 20:40:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Ah ok
Jun 12 20:40:14 <Queeniebee> From my website
Jun 12 20:41:32 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Queeniebee: I'm happy to work with you on your resume specifically sometime when you're on a computer with a keyboard, so we can Etherpad or HackPad it. Sound good?
Jun 12 20:43:03 <Queeniebee> Yes
Jun 12 20:43:12 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Cool! Ping me sometime. I'm in here a lot.
Jun 12 20:44:25 <Queeniebee> Okay I will
Jun 12 20:47:11 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> jlschatz: JadeSquirrel_linux_intern: anya_foreman_intern: terrrydactyl: riecatnor: shivani: thought I'd give you a reminder that the OPW career office hours for this week are going on for another 75 min, in case you have any job or job-search questions
Jun 12 20:47:39 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> (mostly people in North America, and it is conceivable for a person in India to be awake)
Jun 12 21:06:08 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> so right now I am rereading the posts I have made to my blog under the "Work" category
Jun 12 21:06:22 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> including something I said in late 2010: "I'm seeking a new position as a project manager or open source community coordinator. From here I'd like to get into product management with a sideline in mentoring engineers in career development."
Jun 12 21:07:37 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> this mostly worked out!
Jun 12 21:07:50 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> except I have done very little product mgmt
Jun 12 21:24:09 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Oh wow, I'd forgotten I'd written this: " Is it possible to feel like a completely lost pioneer and a cliché sellout at the same time?"
Jun 12 21:40:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> ok, 20 more minutes litac I'm happy to chat more if you'd like
Jun 12 21:41:18 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: haha. well I want to figure out my remote setup. i’ve learned i should find co-working spaces
Jun 12 21:41:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: it's a very good idea. litac are you in SF? can you simply work from Dropbox?
Jun 12 21:42:19 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I work at dropbox once a week! but that is most jessica could get
Jun 12 21:43:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: https://blog.mozilla.org/places/2013/08/26/san-franciscos-first-and-second-floor-expansion/
Jun 12 21:44:09 <karen> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor, sorry for not catching your question earlier
Jun 12 21:44:23 <karen> I have been to LCA twice, once as a keynoter and once as a session speaker
Jun 12 21:44:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> no prob karen
Jun 12 21:44:39 <karen> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I'm thinking of submitting again this year, it's a great conference
Jun 12 21:44:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> cooooooool
Jun 12 21:45:41 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> karen: do you remember whether Mozilla's SF office is interested in having OPW interns co-work there?
Jun 12 21:45:57 <karen> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor, it's great to see you dishing out the good advice here
Jun 12 21:46:15 <karen> I can't remember sumanah_wikimedia_mentor, but I think twitter might be open to it
Jun 12 21:47:33 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marina: hey, could you help me reach out to our Twitter & Mozilla org admins so we can see whether litac could cowork in one of those offices maybe 1 day/wk?
Jun 12 21:47:56 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> if she can do 1 day/wk in Mozilla, Dropbox, & Twitter offices, those'd cut down on her loneliness a bit I bet
Jun 12 21:48:02 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: that would be awesome!!
Jun 12 21:48:02 <litac> yes
Jun 12 21:48:06 <litac> very much so!
Jun 12 21:49:34 <marina> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I sure can - perhaps I should ask if they can host several interns
Jun 12 21:50:01 <marina> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: is there an option to work from Wikimedia's office?
Jun 12 21:50:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marina: maybe! I shall leave that particular question up to you, but I am leaning towards asking whether they could host a few.
Jun 12 21:50:24 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marina: I'm not sure on that; ask Quim? I know there's construction going on for at least part of June.....
Jun 12 21:50:26 <marina> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: yes, that would be fun
Jun 12 21:50:50 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marina: have you ever spoken at linux.conf.au? the call for talks is up http://linux.conf.au/cfp
Jun 12 21:51:07 * sumanah_wikimedia_mentor waits for other people to praise LCA and implicitly encourage interns to submit talks
Jun 12 21:51:09 <marina> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I haven't; thanks for pointing me to it
Jun 12 21:52:04 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Interns: They want talks about all kinds of open source programming stuff, not just Linux. they partly or fully fund travel for speakers. And the audience gets what we're doing, and it's a fun chance to show off your project
Jun 12 21:52:45 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> karen: thank you for the kind words.
Jun 12 21:53:18 <marina> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: I think I'll send three separate e-mails then to Twitter, Wikimedia, and Mozilla, CCing you for further coordination; does that sound good?
Jun 12 21:53:25 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: in the meantime, yes, coworking spaces. http://wiki.coworking.org/w/page/16583935/SanFranciscoCoworking
Jun 12 21:53:27 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> marina: ok!
Jun 12 21:53:32 <marina>
Jun 12 21:54:00 <karen>
Jun 12 21:54:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I think at least one friend of mine also likes to work from the Black Point Cafe litac
Jun 12 21:54:57 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor, marina: thank you so much!!!!
Jun 12 21:55:13 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: this is is awesome!! i had no idea there were so many
Jun 12 21:55:36 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> litac: http://blog.valerieaurora.org/2012/09/28/the-best-place-to-work-from-coffee-shop-in-san-francisco-black-point-cafe/
Jun 12 21:55:52 <marina> litac: is there a particular day of the week you are working from Dropbox and is that set in stone?
Jun 12 21:56:26 <litac> marina: I’ve been switching between wednesdays and fridays. but it is suppose to be wednesdays
Jun 12 21:56:49 <marina> litac: ok
Jun 12 21:57:06 <litac> marina: I really appreciate this! thank you so much
Jun 12 21:57:31 <litac> sumanah_wikimedia_mentor: black point cafe sounds AMAZING
Jun 12 21:57:34 <litac> i am totally going there
Jun 12 21:57:51 <marina> litac: a friend of mine works at Invitae, which is a Python shop - he's been quizzing me about how to get more women into their engineering team
Jun 12 21:57:59 <marina> and it generally sounds like a cool company
Jun 12 21:58:12 <marina> so you might like to check it out too
Jun 12 21:58:14 <litac> marina: that sounds awesome!
Jun 12 21:58:21 <litac> thanks for the info!!
Jun 12 21:58:26 <litac> i will check it out
Jun 12 21:58:51 <marina> litac: if you decide it sounds interesting, I can pass on your resume
Jun 12 22:00:22 <litac> marina: absolutely! thanks!!!
Jun 12 22:00:32 <marina> litac: of course!
Jun 12 22:04:18 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> OK, I think this wraps things up
Jun 12 22:04:40 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> I think this particular hour was quite quiet and I think the next time I'll schedule it sometime better for India/Thailand
Jun 12 22:05:55 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> The next career guidance office hours will be sometime in July
Jun 12 22:06:07 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> but I'll be around here sometimes and you can ping me in IRC or email
Jun 12 22:06:26 <litac> thanks sumanah_wikimedia_mentor!:)
Jun 12 22:06:31 <sumanah_wikimedia_mentor> Thanks all
- *** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jun 12 22:08:07 2014